2024 Election - Thread #1

[robkelk]

AP: Trump chooses anti-vaccine activist Robert F. Kennedy Jr. as health secretary

Oh, and I got my COVID-19 and flu vaccine shots today.

[Labster]

Overall, I do want to say I urge calm regardless what side of the political aisle you are on, stay calm. The world did not end in 2016, it did not end in 2020, it will not end now.

That's easy for you to say, when the world isn't literally on fire around you the days after the election.  And I do mean literally literally -- I have two air purifiers running at full blast and the house still smells like smoke.  The world is ending, slowly but surely, as we once again abandon our holy duty of stewardship of the land and its creatures, all sacrificed on the altar of economy and avarice.

At least I finally know, without a doubt, that more than half of my countrymen are evil.  And we're definitely gonna hit +3°C.  I'm not sure what to do with that knowledge.  Right now, it just makes me want to give up.

First off, I hope the heat problems where you are abate, that sounds terrible. Second, as someone who was apathetic to either outcome, and someone who studies history, calling your political opponents evil is incredibly stupid. If they have committed grievous error, burning any bridge towards winning them back to your side is a bad idea.

Also, and this is the last I will address this topic, I want to throw on some water on the fire of panic here with a little history lesson.

Adolf Hitler and the Nazis only got to do what they wanted to Germany only after they seized the Reichstag Fire as an excuse and got the Enabling Act, which allowed them to rule by decree and ashcan any hope of democracy. It was with that Germany was condemned to fascist thrall. The very fact Democrats have, to this point, not done a January 6 is to their credit, and if they want to prevent an American Enabling Act, they'd be wise to not let a January 6 happen by their own hand, assuming the other side truly wants an excuse. 

The United States is far more fundamentally stable than Weimar Germany right now, and the fact you can even complain about the election without disappearing into the night and fog means you are not under a fascist boot YET. My advice, keep being sensible and make the other side make the mistake. Your time will come, just be smart and don't do something foolish in your upset lest your fears become a self-fulfilling prophecy.

With that, I'm noping out of this conversation. I was prepared to sleep just as soundly if Kamala won as I do now, and no, I do not believe people with different opinions who should be elected leaders are categorically evil. That was the same attitude that led the Nazis to murder the Jews, and I advise not repeating that mistake no matter how mad you are.

I guess the thing is that I was grieving a bit when I wrote this, grieving for what we have lost and what we have yet to lose.  A more clearheaded thing to say would be that voting for Trump was sinful, and I should hate the sin but love the sinner.  I should.  Last night I said a six word prayer: "But how can I love them?"

I guess the only moral standpoint I can understand is one that believes abortion is murder.  I think the biblical evidence for this point of view is weak.  "I knew you before you were born" is a statement of God's omniscience ... or that the souls were in the Guf before being incarnated, and we don't know when that is.  What we know is that Hebrew boys didn't join the tribe until their eighth day of life.  But I still understand a view that abortion is a violent act against God's plan, even if I'm unsure I agree.

But, like, none of that matters to Trump.  The only reason he's opposed to abortion is that it gets him votes and devotees.  He doesn't care about women, so why not?  Even it if is in fact the moral course, Trump's opinion based on cold calculation, apathy, and callousness.  I think I have enough to back this up, from the comments about how "women will let you grab them by the pussy" to his divorced wives, to his fling with a porn star, to his apparent lack of affection to his current wife.  Oh, and how his administration separated immigrant childen from their mothers — I haven't forgotten that one — and he didn't once condemn his own government for its cruelty.

Conservative voices have talked a lot about how God has raised up Donald J. Trump for us, and I have always thought that this is probably true.  Like in the story of the Exodus, where God hardened Pharaoh's heart, so that his people would have no choice but to leave and seek the promised land in Palestine.  This was the test of our people.  God offered us a man who lies as often as he breathes; he has born false witness (e.g. the Central Park Five), committed adultery, and coveted women.  He plans to turn away immigrants from the south, and expel as many as possible -- and those people are our brothers and sisters in Christ.

This was the test that was set for us by God.  And we failed.

And here's the kicker: that thing about hardening Trump's heart, I really do literally believe that.  The man is a psychopath.  I don't think he actually has a moral compass, not the same way that you and I do, or honestly the morals that even my terrier has.  That part of him is just missing.  So it's hard to say how culpable he is for his sin, if God has withdrawn from him the true understanding of good and evil.

But for the rest of us, we don't get off so easy.  We can't all assign our culpability, our sin, to our lack of empathy.  Instead of seeing the man as the monster that he is, lots of Americans have take his actions as an excuse to follow his lead.  To take part in pride at how Great America is.  To hate our neighbors.  To follow our greed rather than accept people who need help.  To be wrathful and take joy in owning the libs.  To indulge our fears of needles and races.  The weight of sin on a Trump voter, with their own conscience and ostensibly Christian morals is far greater than the weight of sin on Trump himself.

The difference between the candidates was like night and day, which is honestly why I couldn't stand to join the campaign this year.  One candidate is like a walking demon, spreading sinfulness wherever he goes, and the other one is not that.  And between night and day, we chose the night, we chose the literal fascist, we chose the man who is an exemplar of what a man should not do, how our children should not behave, so that we can feel justified in letting our basest instincts run wild.  And this is the evil that Trump voters have invited into our government and the evil Trump voters have welcomed into their own hearts.

The collective blame is on them for what happens next.

[SilverFang01]

Between this: Dr. Oz picked to lead Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services. What does it do?, and this: Trump picks Robert F. Kennedy JR. to be his Department of Health Secretary

Will the US at last be implementing the famous Death Panels that were brought up back when health reform was being discussed in the double o's?

[classicdrogn]

Why not, we've already got doctors so afraid of gettingnsent to prison for helping a woman having a miscarriage that she dies in the parking lot. Just respecting the shit out of life all over here - maggots have to eat too you know.

[hazard]

The US has had de facto death panels for decades.

What do you think those insurers hire all those doctors for? To check if claims are reasonable?

No, it's so they can find any excuse to deny a claim... even and especially claims that will cost the company shit tons of money due to long term illness while the premium doesn't offset it.