Live Sailor Moon #18

[Bob Schroeck]

Okay, it's official.
This particular Minako is a class-one bitch.
It wasn't "I'm a combat veteran and you're not" -- it was just outright nastiness. I'm hoping this is a front that she's putting up as part of her "I'm the Princess" decoy act; if it's not, this is nothing like the Minako we know.
Oh, and add another dose of confusion to the power activation issue. Big extended fight scene in this ep, and the girls all do some variety of the ridiculous windups in the middle of the action -- not the stock footage, but the moves from it, in the middle of the battle. That's pretty ridiculous. They were fighting Jadeite and one of the other Generals, and should have gotten their asses kicked because of the stupid posing and whatnot.
Venus did another zap without any preamble, but she also did the "Love-Me Chain" with a full call and stock footage scene. Not a bad effect on the attack, either.
Anyway, it's back to the drawing board as far as figuring out what's dramatic license and what's not. I'm beginning to think I should just give up and do whatever works for the story.


-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[The Wanderer]

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I'm beginning to think I should just give up and do whatever works for the story.

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I thought that was a given anyway, at least as far as the live-action series went?
Somewhat apropos of this, there's an idea I've come across in an existing fic which I've been meaning to run past you in this general regard; are you familiar with Mark Shurtleff's "Relatively Absent", and if so have you seen Chapter 7?

[chibipoe]

Well, I've had her pegged as a Class One Bitch since 12(I think that's right), when she cut Zoisite down in cold blood like that. And I was really getting to LIKE this incarnation of Zoisite(and that is a massive accomplishment, IMO, since I loathe the Zoisite of the anime). And her attitude in general seems very...superior. And not in an entertaining way. It's a 'I am Better Than All of You and Look at me, Look at Me! I'm the Princess."
(there were moments where I was truly convinced that she believed she was the Princess. It was the only thing that explained some of her behavior. It did make me look at Artemis approvingly, since it suggested, IMO, that he had fostered this decepticon and that's rather cold and calculating.)
Anyway. Assorted rambles from me. Venus, Minako, etc, whatever you call her. She's a bitch.(I think 18 had her doing the bit with trying to outdo Rei about helping the dog. And that just....geh.)
(Note from Bob: I accidentally hit Edit instead of Reply to this message, and screwed up chibipoe's original post; fortunately I had a copy in another window and could restore it.)
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[Star Ranger4]

Umm, where are you guys getting these from?"I was an Otaku before those kids came along and changed the meaning of the word."
-- HM "Howling Mad" Wilson to more than one team-mate.
Hear that thunder rolling till it seems to split the sky?
That's every ship in Grayson's Navy taking up the cry-
NO QUARTER!!!
-- "No Quarter", by Echo's Children

[cpt kangarooski]

Since ancient times, videos have been brought from the far-off Orient to the Americas via BitTorrent. I'd suggest getting yourself a good BT program (e.g. Azureus) and seeing what's available at some fansubbing sites (e.g. Animesuki).

[chibipoe]

You can get the BTs for PGSM at....
TV-Nihon
Also has several other live action sentai shows and such. Has a sub of the first episode of the new Transformers series as well.
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[nemonowan]

> This particular Minako is a class-one bitch.
> It wasn't "I'm a combat veteran and you're not"
> -- it was just outright nastiness. I'm hoping this
> is a front that she's putting up as part of her "I'm
> the Princess" decoy act; if it's not, this is nothing
> like the Minako we know.
She is more like the manga Minako, but not quite. I'm
sure she knows she isn't the real princess, but just
her kagemusha. What I'm not 100% sure of is if she's
aware that the real princess is Sailor Moon - there
have been some hints of that, like ordering Mars to
stick to Sailor Moon all the time.
In any case, given her mission as decoy, it makes
sense that she strives to keep the others away, by
being deliberately nasty if necessary.
On top of that, there is some cliche foreshadowing
that she is terminally ill ("only six months left...")
and that she won't make friends with the other senshi
to keep them from being hurt by her death (which
attitude is another BIG cliche in japanese media)
NN

[Bob Schroeck]

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In any case, given her mission as decoy, it makes
sense that she strives to keep the others away, by
being deliberately nasty if necessary.

---

It is true that she does seem to regret having to do it. So you're probably right -- but damn, could she maybe pour a little lemon juice in that paper cut? (Sorry, movie quote just seized me there.)

---

On top of that, there is some cliche foreshadowing
that she is terminally ill ("only six months left...")
and that she won't make friends with the other senshi
to keep them from being hurt by her death (which
attitude is another BIG cliche in japanese media)

---

Huh. Didn't catch that. I thought she was talking about another time limit -- like maybe an estimate for the awakening of Meta(r|ll)ia.



-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[Bob Schroeck]

---

Somewhat apropos of this, there's an idea I've come across in an existing fic which I've been meaning to run past you in this general regard; are you familiar with Mark Shurtleff's "Relatively Absent", and if so have you seen Chapter 7?

---

Oh yeah, I've been following it -- in fact, I owe Mark a reply on an email exchange. I presume you're referring to the "naked whirly light show" as a training aid, a motivation to learn to change faster? Yeah, cool idea.


-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[Bob Schroeck]

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(there were moments where I was truly convinced that she believed she was the Princess. It was the only thing that explained some of her behavior. It did make me look at Artemis approvingly, since it suggested, IMO, that he had fostered this decepticon and that's rather cold and calculating.)

---

Huh. I can't remember now if their conversations had ever suggested she wasn't actually the Princess... you could be right, which would be very interesting indeed.

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I think 18 had her doing the bit with trying to outdo Rei about helping the dog. And that just....geh.)

---

Oh, yeah. Minako does have a bit of an ego problem, doesn't she?
For those who tuned in late, Minako and Rei were helping a Catholic priest nurse a sick dog back to health. After Rei finds out that Minako is a) Sailor Venus/the Princess and b) the idol singer Usagi spazzes over, they end up in a rather childish competition over who can do more for the dog. Example: They insist on calling the dog different names. Minako pulls up at the church just as Rei walks up with a bag of dry dog food; Minako immediately has her driver take her away, then shows up later with several large cartons of the "highest quality" canned dog food. When a poster is needed to alert the dog's owner that he's been found, Rei volunteers, but Minako breaks out her junior Michaelango paints kit and does this monster poster easily a meter by a meter and a half, with a full-color, full-body painting of the dog. (More evidence, here, of the Renaissance Woman Minako, since the painting is a very professional job.) They spend the better part of the episode trying to show each other up.

-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[Bob Schroeck]

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Umm, where are you guys getting these from?

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TV-Nihon, as chibipoe has noted. PGSM is broadcast on Saturday nights in Japan, and T-N usually has the fansub seeded for torrenting by the following Thursday. Tonight, for example, Episode 19 from Saturday the 14th should be available. This gives us the opportunity to comment and critique the series more or less in real time with the broadcasts.


-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[The Wanderer]

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I presume you're referring to the "naked whirly light show" as a training aid, a motivation to learn to change faster?

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Yes, but there's a little more to it than that, which it isn't clear to me whether or not you noticed.
The basic idea, which Mark tells me he got from Kenko, is that it is actually the "dance" which brings on the transformation - all the transformation item, phrase and whirly lightshow do is send the transformee though the necessary motions automatically, like a magical puppet; if she is capable of remembering the motions and executing them independently, then she can transform without all of those accoutrements.
The flaw in this is that it does not appear to allow for times when the Senshi transform faster than normal, nor for things like ChibiUsa's transformation - but it's still the most original take on the whole notion which I've seen in my entire time reading fanfiction, and I thought it might be worth considering even if you don't end up using it.

[Bob Schroeck]

Hm. Oddly enough, that almost seems to work in the context of the live series... given that Venus can change at will without all the extra stuff.
Oh, and no, I hadn't picked that up. That's a very cool idea. I'm going to have to start hanging out in the IRC channel that Ed and Kenko and all them frequent -- there just seems to be a fantastic meeting of the minds going on in there.


-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[Logan Darklighter]

Hmmm, which channel is this?

[chibipoe]

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Huh. I can't remember now if their conversations had ever suggested she wasn't actually the Princess... you could be right, which would be very interesting indeed.

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To my knowledge, no, none of their conversations have presented as if she wasn't the Princess. Yet, there's still the undercurrent and the comments here and there that suggest she -knows-. (back around 8 or so, I was fully convinced that she knew it all, and was running interference with full knowledge that she wasn't the Princess.) Then, we get her first meeting with Usagi and the whole bit where she had a REAL problem with Usagi's carefree attitude.
I suppose part of my problem could be from the fact that I know what's going on here, more or less, and the way this is being handled is crossing signals with the information in my head, etc, etc. But she acts as if she is only the decoy at certain moments(like when giving Rei the big 'stay with Sailor Moon and the others' bit, that got Rei to thinking), but in their private conversations between her and Artemis, they continue the fiction(note: 10 or 11 when she is agog over Usagi being Moon that she doesn't go to the Planetary Festival thing. And Artemis says to her: Aren't you going? You're the Princess!")
So, all in all, I'm still liking the way this is being handled, but parts of the Minako thing are just baffling me completely, since they seem contradictory.
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[Bob Schroeck]

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Hmmm, which channel is this?

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Honestly, I don't know. Ed mentions it once in a while -- sometimes he's in it while I'm on the phone with him, and we get into clumsy three-way conversations that get relayed between text and voice between him. But I don't know exactly what server or channel name.


-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[Bob Schroeck]

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So, all in all, I'm still liking the way this is being handled, but parts of the Minako thing are just baffling me completely, since they seem contradictory.

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I'm trusting that it'll be explained, somehow. But I'm just a little worried -- for a few episodes now, there's been a very nice consistency and continuity all over the board, and now things are getting odd and inconsistent again. I'm hoping there's a reason for it all.
Oh well... anyway, off to TV-Nihon to see if ep 19 is up yet...


-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[chibipoe]

I hope so as well.
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[The Wanderer]

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Hm. Oddly enough, that almost seems to work in the context of the live series... given that Venus can change at will without all the extra stuff.

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Maybe I was unclear... the movements, the dancing around and so forth, are hypothesized to be required; if one isn't going to use the transformation item/phrase and go through the swirly lightshow, one needs to perform the motions independently, and regardless it's not going to make instantaneous transformations possible (except maybe for people capable of DBZ-level speed, who probably wouldn't NEED it).
The idea might still be modified to make it more usable, but as it stands it has its flaws.
=====
Edit to add:
Oh, and if you find out what and where that IRC channel is, do please let me know. If they allow lurkers, I might like to start spending some time there myself.

[Bob Schroeck]

Okay, yeah, I did misunderstand you. No, that doesn't line up with what the live series does, but it's still a good idea.
Oh, and as for the IRC channel, you'd be better off asking Ed for the info.


-- Bob
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There is no spork.

[Logan Darklighter]

"except for people with DBZ-level speed, who probably wouldn't need it..."
Now I'm imagining Ranma-chan doing the 'transformation dance' at amaguriken-level speed, as other writers have speculated upon him doing things such as, say, changing clothes....

[The Wanderer]

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I'm imagining Ranma-chan doing the 'transformation dance' at amaguriken-level speed

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You'll note that I said "maybe" - because the transformation movements frequently involve pauses, I'm not sure increased speed would actually work. It could be interpreted as proportional, though, if one really wanted to do it that way.

[Bob Schroeck]

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at amaguriken-level speed, as other writers have speculated upon him doing things such as, say, changing clothes....

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You're probably thinking of that one story where he basically becomes a faux magical girl, and uses a combination of amaguriken and Mousse's Hidden Weapons to effect a "transformation"... I seem to remember black leather being part of his outfit in that; I just can't remember the title or author, dammit.


-- Bob
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There's no wrong way to eat a Rhesus.