Order of the Phoenix

[Bob Schroeck]

Peg and I went out and saw the new Harry Potter movie last night. Forthwith my rambling thoughts on it.
First off, be aware it's long -- at least 2 1/2 hours, maybe closer to 2 3/4. It won't seem like it for most viewers, mind you, but just so you don't go into shock when you look at your watch after it's over, be warned.
Overall, good job of adaptation. Things were, inevitably, left out, as OoTP is where Rowling's books start getting really big, but to my surprise a lot more major points made it in than happened with Goblet of Fire. Hmm. Kreacher's betrayal is gone. Marietta Edgecomb is gone, with unexpected repercussions, plot- and character-wise. The painting of Mrs. Black is hinted at rather than shown, and we never get to hear her go off on a tirade. And most disturbingly, almost all Ginny plot/sublot is gone. (More on this below.) Um. I'm sure there were more but I can't recall them now.
Pleasant surprises: The Thestrals -- one, for looking really well-done, and two, because the trailers with the shots of Harry on a broom flying through London led me to believe they might have scrapped the thestrals entirely. Luna Lovegood -- Evanna Lynch is a lot lower-key than I expected Luna to be, and a lot less, um, spacey, but surprisingly good. Sirius going through the veil is profoundly creepy -- and more heartbreaking because of how it's done.
Disappointments: Because of the sheer amount of material the move had to cover, Tonks, Shacklebolt and others in the Order had very little screen time. I especially wanted to see more of Tonks, because Natalia Tena seemed to be doing a particularly good job with her. She just didn't get to do much. The Ministry battle -- is unexpectedly gutted. All the heroism and tragedy of the DA's participation has been completely removed. They break into the prophecy room, they run into Death Eaters, they get cornered in the veil room, the Order comes and does the real fighting. Worst of all, the Prophecy is edited and Neville's part in it thrown away -- this is just unbelievable, given how central the prophecy is to the overall plot arc.
Unexpected: Umbridge. I'd been conditioned to expect a harsh-voiced hag; I wasn't expecting her infamous "hem hem" to turn out to be a high-pitched titter. Still want to murder her in her sleep, though. Harry's brief relationship with Cho seems more... grown-up? mature? ... than it does in the book.
No cast changes in the kids this film. Looks like they've finally standardized their Patil twins, so I think they've finally locked down the student cast (tho' they've had most of it permanently defined since the first one).
One major concern, related to that: Bonnie Wright, who plays Ginny. She was hired for the first movie at something like 9 or 10, and all she had to do in it was hide behind Julie Waters and peer at Daniel Radcliffe. I don't remember much of her performance at all in Chamber of Secrets, and over the subsequent movies, I've noticed that she gets almost no lines. In this film, the only things I remember her actually saying are spell incantations! I am beginning to wonder if they signed her for a long-term contract, and then discovered that she couldn't act... because by god, they are writing the movies such that she is little more than a piece of moving furniture. She's got the most powerful zap in the DA, yes, but there's no real interaction between her and Harry. Luna Lovegood gets more screen time with Harry by orders of magnitude -- in fact, I think they were trying to set up a Harry-Luna relationship in this film! Harry and Luna have two good-length scenes together where it seems clear that they're trying to show a kind of kinship between the two, and Harry's clearly responding to something about her. I'd really like to know what other people think on this one when they see it.
Anyway... capsule review: Nicely done, far fewer inexplicable deletions than the last film, worth first run prices and the nearly 3 hours in the theatre that it'll take.

-- Bob
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The Internet Is For Norns.

[WengFook]

you know... since rowling has officially supported the Harry/Ginny pairing.. one can't help but wonder.... maybe the films will be the counterpoint? especially with the way they are leaning XD_______________________________
We're definitely playing this game wrong. I thought Vampire was supposed to be a game of personal horror, not about ninja magic-carpet airstrikes at night.
- A friend after playing a session of Dark Ages Vampire.
A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away. THERE IS ONLY WAR!
-Same friend.
_________________________________
Take Your Candle, Go Light Your World.

[Bob Schroeck]

Oh, and I thought of one other change that struck me as just bizarre -- Harry and Dumbledore's talk at the end. Instead of Harry being mad as hell and smashing up the office, it's all way, way too calm.
And one good mythology gag that I noticed -- when they go to Hogsmeade (the design of which seems to have changed again) to start talking about the DA, they enter the Hog's Head, and the bartender shoos a goat away from behind the bar. I laughed out loud at that, as did a few other folks in the theatre; Peggy missed it, as apparently the rest of the audience did as well.

-- Bob
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The Internet Is For Norns.

[Shepherd]

Actually, I think that the movie is ONLY about 2 hours 18 minutes.
While I liked it I felt that they breezed through most of the material too quickly to be effective. I would have expanded the student prank war on Umbridge into a montage scene while combining several of the Luna Lovegood scenes to save time elsewhere.
My biggest complaint is that the CGI Grawp looks like a bad stereotype of a big retarded guy. While he is quite stupid I feel that it is in poor taste to make him look like a retarded human.
On the other hand, since I saw the IMAX version I have to say that the 3D battle at the end was fairly good (from the Thestralback flight to the Department of Mysteries straight through the end of the Dumbledore/Voldemort fight). It may not have quite been worth the extra money for the tickets, tolls, and gas as compared to seeing it in a nearby regular theater but I was still impressed.
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"Anyone can be a winner if their definition of victory is flexible enough." - The DM of the Rings XXXV

[M Fnord]

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you know... since rowling has officially supported the Harry/Ginny pairing.. one can't help but wonder....

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Well, apparently the producers like to get story approval from Rowling, just to make sure the trimmed-down films still fit the Master Plan. Could be good old J.K.'s setting up a massive swerve. We'll know in a week or so if that's true, I suppose.
(I'm kind of hoping it is, just because watching the two powerhouses of the Great Shipping Wars both get torpedoed in the home stretch would be entertainment far outstripping anything Book 7 could offer. Moo hoo ha ha ha.)---
Mr. Fnord
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Mr. Fnord interdimensional man of mystery

FenWiki - Your One-Stop Shop for Fenspace Information

"I. Drink. Your. NERDRAGE!"

[katreus]

Oh... I noticed things completely different than you, Bob! I haven't read the books in a long time - no interest too, either, really - so I wasn't as focused on the plot as it relates to the books.
I focused a lot more on acting, the overall feel of the movie, and the visual effects as it related to conveying the story.
I thought there were BEAUTIFUL visuals and fantastic acting. Tonks and Bellatrix looked great, and Bella's got her evil sadistic part down pat. Loved it, and something that just sticks in my head: that part where she does some sort of slide into the floo and vanishes right away in the bright green flames (that was pretty awesome too -- the whole floo thing). Compared with what Harry does, I think it's a great illustration of the differences.
The actress for Dolores Umbridge is wonderful, just the sense of underlying menace hidden behind that thin veneer of condescending unctuousness combined with a brilliant sense of comedic timing. I don't know if it's necessarily stole, but I couldn't help noticing her when she's in a scene... and well, I thought she was HILARIOUS. I couldn't stop laughing at her scenes.
Speaking of hilarious people, Alan Rickman. Ah, Snape, you kill me. He didn't get a lot of lines but he definitely was rocking the lines he had. And the two of them together? Words cannot describe the awesomeness of that scene (Snape won the battle, but I think in terms of acting, it was about the same). Those two really know how to use positioning, timing, voices, and body language.
The trio also are handling the roles with aplomb and acting much better. In the case of Harry, well, we've seen before the scream he's tried to do and honestly, it didn't work out well there imo. Radcliffe just couldn't seem to do it before. But MAD PROPS to the director for figuring a way out to help illustrate the emotions and do it in a way that looks absolutely natural and strikes a chord in those watching. Very good job to use dreams, anger, physical displays, poses, and that silent scream. That worked out really, really well.
In terms of backgrounds -- breath taking. This director knows how to time this film: the bleakness, the humor and lighthearted, the contemplation, and the tragic. Great use of backgrounds to illustrate the emotions and to enhance the effect. Department of Mysteries and the Ministry in general gets a well done from me. Really nice way to take the book and make the visual something really, really special.
Also, I'm not quite sure that that mode of moving in terms of the battle as it's portrayed in the movies is really what was meant in the books, but honestly, it looks pretty cool. No complaints here. And, if the black and white teleports were sort of cliche, like I said, it looked fantastic.

[Bob Schroeck]

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I thought there were BEAUTIFUL visuals and fantastic acting. Tonks and Bellatrix looked great, and Bella's got her evil sadistic part down pat. Loved it, and something that just sticks in my head: that part where she does some sort of slide into the floo and vanishes right away in the bright green flames (that was pretty awesome too -- the whole floo thing).

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Oh yeah, I completely agree. The cinematography was excellent -- consider the "feel" of the playground scene at the beginning, too, where the color balance feels very different and somehow carries over the hot, unpleasant weather we hear about.
Helena Bonham Carter was an excellent Bellatrix, even if she was the second choice for the role (I forget who they first tapped, but I remember when she had to bow out and Carter took over). But I really wanted to see more of Tonks.

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In terms of backgrounds -- breath taking.

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Oh yes, excellent visuals everywhere. No argument from me. On any of your points, in fact. I don't think anywhere we really disagree -- we just had different things come to fore when we thought about the film.
I have to admit that I'm still really concerned about what's going on with Bonnie Wright, though. Given the importance of Ginny to the long term plot, they wouldn't be sidelining her without a damned good reason.

-- Bob
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The Internet Is For Norns.

[jpub]

Wouldn't that be a riot? If the movie hints at some major serve in Book 7? One which especially causes all the H/G shippers to scream in untold agony and torment?
But I may be hoping for that just because I'm an ornery jerk.
*shrug*--
Christopher Angel, aka JPublic
The Works of Christopher Angel
"Camaraderie, adventure, and steel on steel. The stuff of legend! Right, Boo?"

[ordnance11]

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Wouldn't that be a riot? If the movie hints at some major serve in Book 7? One which especially causes all the H/G shippers to scream in untold agony and torment?

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Will the biggest plot twist would be if Tom still had a hold on Ginny? Making her a betrayer? I can see that hapening.
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[Rieverre]

Twist? Maybe. Surprising? It's only been _done_ n to the nth power times already.
-Griever
When tact is required, use brute force. When force is required, use greater force.
When the greatest force is required, use your head. Surprise is everything. - The Book of Cataclysm

[Bob Schroeck]

Not by Rowling.
By the way, anyone else notice the cereal boxes in that one breakfast scene in the Great Hall? I spotted "Cheeri-Owls" but I didn't get a chance to read the others.

-- Bob
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The Internet Is For Norns.

[Jeanne Hedge]

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The actress for Dolores Umbridge is wonderful, just the sense of underlying menace hidden behind that thin veneer of condescending unctuousness combined with a brilliant sense of comedic timing. I don't know if it's necessarily stole, but I couldn't help noticing her when she's in a scene... and well, I thought she was HILARIOUS. I couldn't stop laughing at her scenes.

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That was Imelda Staunton. She was a Best Actress Oscar nominee for "Vera Drake" (2004). Yet another of a long line of really terrific British actresses.

With her and Helena Bonham Carter in this movie, after a bit of research I think that makes 11 Oscar winning or nominated actors in the extended Potter ensemble (Kenneth Branagh (1 nomination), Carter (1 nomination), Julie Christie (3 nominations, 1 win), Ralph Fiennes (2x nominee), Richard Harris (2x nominee), John Hurt (2x nominee), Miranda Richardson (2x nominee), Maggie Smith (6 nominations, 2 wins), Staunton (1 nomination), Emma Thompson (4 nominations, 1 win), and Julie Walters (2x nominee)). On top of that, both John Cleese (A Fish Called Wanda) and Emma Thompson (Sense and Sensibility) both have Oscar nominations for screen writing - Thompson won hers. And to top that, Mrs. Thompson's ex, Mr. Branagh has 3 more non-acting nominations - screen writing, directing, and live action short subject(!).
I'm afraid to count up all the BAFTA nominees in this cast!

Jeanne Hedge
www.jhedge.com

"Believe me, if I have to go the rest of my life without companionship, knowing myself won't be a problem."
-- Gabrielle of Potadeia

[Bob Schroeck]

As far back as the second or third film I heard the Potter movies being described as cast with a "Who's Who" of British theatre and cinema.

-- Bob
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The Internet Is For Norns.

[Jeanne Hedge]

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As far back as the second or third film I heard the Potter movies being described as cast with a "Who's Who" of British theatre and cinema.

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If they can get Dame Judi Dench into the cast, I'll be one very happy camper. Hey, the lady gets Oscar nominations for dramatics and wins an Oscar for a role with about 7 minutes of screen time, very frequently appears on stage, is a Bond girl (well, she *is*), and yet spent a large chunk of the 90s/00s (about 11+ years worth) starring in a TV sitcom. That's got to be someone who's not only very flexible but doesn't take herself too seriously.

Jeanne Hedge
www.jhedge.com

"Believe me, if I have to go the rest of my life without companionship, knowing myself won't be a problem."
-- Gabrielle of Potadeia

[DHBirr]

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not only very flexible but doesn't take herself too seriously.

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I've seen some episodes from that sitcom (my mom is a Dench fan, and a living reminder that "fan" is derived from "fanatic"). Based on a few of the things she does in that series, I guarantee you she doesn't take herself too seriously.
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Big Brother is watching you.  And damn, you are so bloody BORING.

[Herr Bad Moon]

Saw it this morning. Will echo what Bob said, though I will say I thought the gang had a better accounting of themselves then I thought they would in the Department of Mysteries. Dumbledore and Tommy boy's sorcerous duel was pretty nifty too.
Yeah, Ginny has pretty much been like most of the rest of the Hogwarts students, just standing around. Seamus and Dea have had more lines then her, and I was really dissapointed I didn't get to see her verbally bitch slap Harry and call him a wanker in Grimmauld Place like in the book. One thing I did chuckle at though was during a scene where Cho and Harry are smiling shyly at each other, Ginny can be seen in the background scowling at them. I agree that it's going to be interesting to see what the hell they do with Bonny Wright in the sixth movie since Harry spends a good portion of that book mooning over Ginny. Not to mention I suspect she'll have an important role in Deathly Hallows.---------------
-Jon
Leo (July 23-Aug. 22)
The population density of Wyoming is very low, but that doesn't mean the people there aren't also out to kill you.
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Jon
"And that must have caused my dad's brain to break in half, replaced by a purely mechanical engine of revenge!"