I Just Realized I Never Mentioned...

[Sofaspud]

But... no one had told her until the last couple days that the opening was entry level and they could only pay $35-45K -- and while I had said I was flexible about salary, she didn't expect me to be that flexible. (And she was right.)

Without intending to open up a salary discussion here, I'd just like to say I had to doubletake at that.  In my area, that's a decent -- not overwhelmingly competitive, but decent -- salary.
Then I looked up cost-of-living in your area.  Yikes.

--sofaspud
--"Listening to your kid is the audio equivalent of a Salvador Dali painting, Spud." --OpMegs

[Bob Schroeck]

Without
intending to open up a salary discussion here, I'd just like to say I
had to doubletake at that.  In my area, that's a decent -- not
overwhelmingly competitive, but decent -- salary.
Then I looked up cost-of-living in your area.  Yikes.

Yeah, we're one of the more expensive areas in the country -- and NYC, where that job was located, is worse. And the cost of commutation into NYC would be considerably more than the per mile costs of driving to Best. Which is why I'm really trying for a job that's in NJ instead of the city -- and why I'm really hoping I get the job I interviewed for yesterday. One of the few things that're cheaper in NJ than elsewhere in the country is gasoline; we average about 50 cents a gallon lower than just about everywhere else, probably because of the refineries around Newark/Elizabeth that give so many visitors the idea that the state is a huge industrial wasteland. (I think there are also some on the Delaware near Philadelphia, too, but I'm far less familiar with that area.) In any case, that makes driving a better deal than the train much of the time, even for surprisingly distant jobs. (Plus with commuting I'd also have to pay for parking by the station on a regular basis, either metered or monthly.)
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[ordnance11]

Okay, I've been getting "Notice of Result" from my recent applications. The one for an environmental GS-9 position at Barstow is at 90%. Which would be great news save the cutoff is 98%. An admin position rated GS-5 OTOH is much better...at 97%. I'm rated "Tentatively Eligible". Which I take to mean, I made the first cut. I'm going to have tweak my resume a little bit and see if I can boos it another 8 points. Time to put more stuff in.
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[robkelk]

and NYC, where that job was located, is worse.

Well, there are bargains available, if you know where to look. (Although I'm not sure I'd want to look in that part of NYC...)
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

(Although I'm not sure I'd want to look in that part of NYC...)

Ahhh, 9th and 41st isn't bad.  They still call it "Hell's Kitchen" but that's just tradition; it's long past the bad days.  But geeze, dollar slices?  I couldn't get a dollar slice even in 1986, the year the article cites for dollar subway fares.  I'll have to check them out.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Sofaspud]

My local Pizza Rita can go them one better: before 4pm, slices go for $0.75 each.  This might have something to do with them being across the street from a high school, admittedly.
They're good, too.  Not as good as one could hope for, but for less than a buck, you're getting your money's worth.  My biggest complaint is that their sauce is not as savory as I like, but that's hardly a deal-breaker.

--sofaspud
--"Listening to your kid is the audio equivalent of a Salvador Dali painting, Spud." --OpMegs

[Bob Schroeck]

Oh, btw, two days ago I had the best "Sorry we can't hire you" call I've ever had. I think I've mentioned the outfit that interviewed me by phone two hours after I sent them my resume, who gave me an aptitude test to take while I was dosed with cold medicine. Well, they got back in touch with me on Wednesday, and the woman at their HR started by practically gushing about how impressed everyone there was with me and how much they'd love to have me working there. But... no one had told her until the last couple days that the opening was entry level and they could only pay $35-45K -- and while I had said I was flexible about salary, she didn't expect me to be that flexible. (And she was right.)

Okay, new developments.  The HR person just called me back -- apparently they want to see me after all, and are willing to up the salary ("be flexible" was how she put it; no specifics were mentioned).  So now I have a huge multistage second-round interview on Monday afternoon in Manhattan, with everyone from the HR director to the CTO.
I'm not sure whether I should take this as looking like an amazing candidate, or that everyone else they've talked to really sucks.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[ordnance11]

Oh, btw, two days ago I had the best "Sorry we can't hire you" call I've ever had. I think I've mentioned the outfit that interviewed me by phone two hours after I sent them my resume, who gave me an aptitude test to take while I was dosed with cold medicine. Well, they got back in touch with me on Wednesday, and the woman at their HR started by practically gushing about how impressed everyone there was with me and how much they'd love to have me working there. But... no one had told her until the last couple days that the opening was entry level and they could only pay $35-45K -- and while I had said I was flexible about salary, she didn't expect me to be that flexible. (And she was right.)

Okay, new developments.  The HR person just called me back -- apparently they want to see me after all, and are willing to up the salary ("be flexible" was how she put it; no specifics were mentioned).  So now I have a huge multistage second-round interview on Monday afternoon in Manhattan, with everyone from the HR director to the CTO.
I'm not sure whether I should take this as looking like an amazing candidate, or that everyone else they've talked to really sucks.

   How about both? She really must have pulled up the stops for you to get a multistage 2nd interview. It's you're too good to pass up and now the trick is to find a slot for you in the company.
  Now I called back the Air Force folks about the admin position. It looks like they're filling a pool of applicants and when the need comes they pull out resumes for the openings, so we're looking at 6 months prior to going to the 2nd stage. The good news is that once you get to the 2nd stage and at least don't scare your putative boss, it's a good chance of getting in.  Ditto for the Navy. Don't call us, we'll call you. Things are looking good for the Army though. 2 out of 4 resumes so far made the first cut, and is being referred to the hiring officials. The weird part right now is with OSHA.  I got a look at the status of my application and found out that the qualifications for the GS-7 and 9 level, but I made the qualification for GS-11. What the hell does that mean?
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[Sofaspud]

Bob: the more cynical take on it could be that her first call was a fishing attempt.  If you jumped at the bait, then the company got you on the cheap.  When doing that sort of stunt, HR folks prefer to come across as your buddy.  They empathize with your position and they know it's a bit of a shock -- why, they almost feel like they're insulting you by offering such low compensation!  But THE COMPANY didn't tell them before, and...
Etc.
Now, I'm not saying this is absolutely the case, but I've been in on the hiring process *a lot*, for large firms, and I can state with absolute certainty that not once have we (the operations and financial team) failed to tell HR how much we can afford to spend on a new hire.  HR then takes that and writes a job posting and usually gets quite a few of the details wrong -- and that may include salary, in fact.  But we've never not told them what the salary ("wage code", in the parlance) is.
All that said, getting a callback is by no means a bad thing!  I would simply advise that you keep in mind that HR does *not* have your best interests in mind, but rather, is dedicated to the company's bottom line.  (Or, even more cynically, to making sure their own positions are rock-solid, which usually is the same thing but has a very different 'feel' to it.)

--sofaspud
--"Listening to your kid is the audio equivalent of a Salvador Dali painting, Spud." --OpMegs

[robkelk]

I got a look at the status of my application and found out that the qualifications for the GS-7 and 9 level, but I made the qualification for GS-11. What the hell does that mean?

That means somebody thinks you're good enough for a GS-11 position. Don't complain; that's more responsibility and more money right away... if you're hired.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

All that said, getting a callback is by no means a bad thing! I would simply advise that you keep in mind that HR does *not* have your best interests in mind, but rather, is dedicated to the company's bottom line. (Or, even more cynically, to making sure their own positions are rock-solid, which usually is the same thing but has a very different 'feel' to it.)

Thanks for the advice, Spud. I do have to admit that I'm a little less likely to jump at this position than I was this time last week -- the opening at the local company will definitely give me at least as much as I was making at Best, and I won't have to pay train fare for the commute. That's assuming I read the interviewer right and I am coming back for a second interview. If I were to get offers from both at about the same time, I would take the local company immediately. So assuming I hear what I expect to hear on Friday-ish from the local place, I can go into the NYC company relaxed and with some confidence and not worrying that it's my only option. Especially since no one at the NYC place has yet to promise me anything close to what I was making at Best, instead only making vague suggestions.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[ordnance11]

I got a look at the status of my application and found out that the qualifications for the GS-7 and 9 level I didn't make, but I made the qualification for GS-11. What the hell does that mean?

That means somebody thinks you're good enough for a GS-11 position. Don't complain; that's more responsibility and more money right away... if you're hired.

          That's my point....I'd rather be a shoe-in for the GS-9 level than take a chance with the GS-11 slot. There more job openings for the GS-9 slot, but now I'm wondering if it's worth the time and effort if HR believes I'm overqualified for the slot.
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[ordnance11]

I got a nibble from BuMed. They want more documentation from me. I've d noticed despite the push toward the 1 stop HR resumes, different agencies still have their HR quirks. The Navy/Marine Corps has a pool concept toward HR. They have civilian job postings continuously open for a year (even if there are no current openings) and screen and pool the resumes. If there is an opening during the year (and they don't hold it for someone else inside), then they start tapping the pool. The downside is that it can take up to a year or longer to get to accepted to a position. Even some parts of the Navy like BuMed have their own way of hiring. Post you resume as an email, and then after screening and you made cut-off, send in your other documents (like DD214s). The army also has their own resume database, but at least you'll know within 45 days of the closing announcement on whether you made first cut or not.

The good news is at least I'm seeing if I do get a job, what GS level I might be accepted on. The highest is GS-11 so far. The lowest possible is GS-5.

So we'll see and hold on to the 4 leaf clover.
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[robkelk]

I got a nibble from BuMed. They want more documentation from me.

That means somebody is interested in you - that's a good sign.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[ordnance11]

I applied to one of the program analyst position GS-7 level in New Orleans U.S Army Corps of Engineers. It was 1 job with a 2 week open time frame. The I got 3 emails. the first email was a notification I was rated "EL" eligible. The next two bout 4 minutes after that rated me "NR" - "not referred" Meaning I didn't meet the first cut with my rating score -94. Which meant that somebody decided to raise the bar to 95. I get the feeling this is one of those "placeholder" announcements. OTOH, I'm pleased that my score IS high enough.
Oh, Bob? How did the multiple interview go?
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[Bob Schroeck]

That's not until Monday afternoon, Ord. Can't tell you yet.

On the other front, the local company didn't get back in touch with me today, which is when I expected to find out if I did in fact make it to the second round there. I dropped the fellow who interviewed me a note in email just to let him know that I'll be incommunicado most of Monday if for any reason he needed to talk to me. I didn't say why, but I'm hoping he'll read between the lines and it'll prompt something.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[ordnance11]

This is a job I'm applying for:

The Iron Mountain VA Medical Center has an opening for an Industrial
Hygienist graduate or post-graduate internship. The Federal Career
Internship Program (FCIP) is designed to help the VA recruit and attract
exceptional individuals into a variety of occupations. 
    Candidate
will be in training through a full-time paid position under an  
experienced professional in the targeted field. Individuals are
appointed into the Excepted Service to a 2-year internship. 
Completion of the internship may lead to a permanent position with our
agency at any of more than 160 VA Medical Centers in all 50 states.  You
must be willing to sign a mobility agreement prior to accepting the
position. Upon successful completion of the two-year program you may apply or may be placed
non-competitively in a VHA position.

     This is a
full-time, paid internship. which will begin on/or about 6/1/2010.

The fly in the ointment is this:
Applicants
who meet the qualification requirements listed above will be further
evaluated by determining the extent to which their work or related
experience, education, training, awards, outside activities, and
supervisory appraisal, etc., indicate they possess the knowledge,
skills, and abilities (KSA's) of the position.  All applicants should
provide clear, concise examples that show the level of accomplishment or
degree to which they possess the KSA.  Incomplete,
vague, or contradictory information may affect the rating.  Please
address the following KSA's on bond paper and attach your responses to
your application material.
I'm not going to list those. Suffice it to say there are 3 levels you can apply to and if you want to be considered for all of them, you'll have to answer all of them. I finished the first level and it took me 4 hours to write 2 pages...and that's with me having a cheat sheet in front of me! It's a good thing it's not due till the end of the month. Well 1 down, 2 to go!

__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[robkelk]

Digression: Steve Jackson Games is looking for some skilled people, according to this year's Report to the Stakeholders. They're looking for particular people, though - they haven't posted anything on their "Working for Steve Jackson Games" page.

When asked about this, SJ replied:

Sometimes we just think "We should hire this person," and make an offer. And for jobs that require a specific expertise and don't require knowledge of gaming, Craigslist proves useful. We like to tell our fans when we have an opening, but we do get a lot of "I HAZ NO SKILZ BUT I LUV GAMS && LERNS FAST CAN I HAZ JOB PLZ" responses.

Which got this reply:

%[link=http://img687.imageshack.us/i/user16801177152362.jpg/]
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

I want it. That so typifies how I feel some days.
ETA:  I am suddenly tempted to write Steve an email starting with "I HAZ MAD SKILZ AND I LUV GAMS && LERNS FAST CAN I HAZ JOB PLZ" and then seriously asking if he has something that be done long-distance... but on second thought, he'll probably have more than enough local candidates that he would have no need of a telecommuter, regardless of personal history.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

And it's not even 10:45 AM yet.
As most folks here probably know already, I had an appointment for a second interview -- a monster of a second interview -- with a company in NYC this afternoon.
When I agreed to that appointment, I had forgotten that I had also promised to take my mother-in-law to the train station this morning so she can leave on a trip to Florida.  No problem, sez I when I remember, she's using one of the trains I was planning on using -- I'll just pick her up on my way, and we'll get on together, and we'll keep each other company as far as the Newark Airport station.
But wait, sez the wife, my mother is probably going to have lots of bags and she's not walking that well recently --you're probably going to have to tote them all up onto the platform and into the train for her, and you'll get all sweaty and you don't want to go to your interview all sweaty now, do you?
Um, no, sez I.  I guess I'll take her to the train in my grubbies, then come back home, change into my suit, and go back to the train station.
Pleased with this solution, I go to bed.  A couple hours later than I should have.  And get a bad night's sleep.
So I wake up with an insufficient-sleep headache, do my morning ablutions, and get dressed.  I get Peggy up and off to work.  I get Peg's mom to the train -- and she has only one bag, and it's no effort to get it and her about.  I get home, change, and get back to the train station.  And get to watch the last train that would make things convenient for me pull out as I get up on the platform.
No problem, sez I, I will just have to have a quicker lunch than I planned.  I buy my tickets and sit down to wait for the next train, some 45 minute hence.
So what am I doing here describing all this instead of sitting on the train or hitting the mean streets of NYC?
Simple.  While I was having one of those days, so was the company that I am going to interview at.  As I sat on the platform waiting, the HR person called me and asked if I would mind rescheduling, because she was out sick, and the CTO's daughter was in the hospital with a possible broken hand, and so on...  I graciously allowed as how that would make my life a bit easier given the course of my day, and we both agreed to arrange a new interview date tomorrow, when she would (hopefully) be back in the office.  So I went home, where I could be headachy and tired without it affecting my future employment prospects as much as it might have.
Thus endeth the lesson.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

Just got an email from the guy at the local company -- he said it took him a little longer than he expected to set up a coding test thing that he wants the second-round candidates to do, and that he'll be ready to start on Wednesday. Again he didn't actually say he was having me back, but once again he gave me more detail than I think he'd be inclined to give someone he was going to say "thanks but no thanks" to.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[ordnance11]

Dodged the bullet on that one Bob.
I got an email back from the BuMed HR saying that I qualify for the GS-9 level for the Industrial Hygienist field and that if any slots open up in the locations I placed, she'll let me know. I emailed back to her that I am open to any slots in CONUS or overseas.
I'm begiining to think of job hunting as fishing...Throw the bait out there and hope for the big one. Right now I'll settle for a nibble.
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[Jeanne Hedge]

Bob Schroeck wrote:

---

And it's not even 10:45 AM yet.
As most folks here probably know already, I had an appointment for a second interview -- a monster of a second interview -- with a company in NYC this afternoon.

So what am I doing here describing all this instead of sitting on the train or hitting the mean streets of NYC?
Simple.  While I was having one of those days, so was the company that I am going to interview at.  As I sat on the platform waiting, the HR person called me and asked if I would mind rescheduling, because she was out sick, and the CTO's daughter was in the hospital with a possible broken hand, and so on...  I graciously allowed as how that would make my life a bit easier given the course of my day, and we both agreed to arrange a new interview date tomorrow, when she would (hopefully) be back in the office.  So I went home, where I could be headachy and tired without it affecting my future employment prospects as much as it might have.
Thus endeth the lesson.

.
.
.
.
Bob Schroeck wrote:

---

Just got an email from the guy at the local company -- he said it took him a little longer than he expected to set up a coding test thing that he wants the second-round candidates to do, and that he'll be ready to start on Wednesday. Again he didn't actually say he was having me back, but once again he gave me more detail than I think he'd be inclined to give someone he was going to say "thanks but no thanks" to.

What the crap is it about today?  I spent half the day doing interviews with various witnesses for an investigation I'm working on. Interviews? More like written legal depositions. The dates on these things are very important.  And not 30 minutes ago I realized that everything I'd done during that time carries tomorrow's date.  

  

Jeanne Hedge
www.jhedge.com

"Believe me, if I have to go the rest of my life without companionship, knowing myself won't be a problem."
-- Gabrielle of Potadeia

[ordnance11]

I was going through my list when 2 jobs popped up:
1. A job matching my old job in the private sector.
2. A job in the place I'm volunteering.
Both closes today.
Talk about mad scrmable, but it's done.
__________________
Into terror!,  Into valour!
Charge ahead! No! Never turn
Yes, it's into the fire we fly
And the devil will burn!
- Scarlett Pimpernell

[Bob Schroeck]

Good luck!

The HR person from Agile Company In NYC called me back. I'm now rescheduled for next Wednesday, 3/31.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.