Grrr.

[Valles]

Birds of Prey.
Having only seen one episode, I can't really be certain, but I think I agree with the reviewer - It's very good.
Unfortunately, it's also cancelled. Still, I can sort of see Doug trying to set up a local version of the Warriors, complete with UN charter.
Or, howsabout Firefly?
Likewise excellent, likewise cancelled, and a place that would, if you play his arrival right, be interestingly hard for Doug to deal with. I picture him standing in the middle of a dusty street staring after a town's worth of fleeing people going, "Um, what's a reaver?" Immediately followed by him kicking ass, which in turn would lead to a visit by The Men With Blue Hands, which would leave him in need of a ship that wouldn't go somewhere it'd attract attention...
After all, when They're after you, you have to keep flying.
Blessed be.
-n
(It's decisions like -that- that breed communists.)
===========

===============================================
"V, did you do something foolish?"
"Yes, and it was glorious."

[Bob Schroeck]

I've seen a couple eps of "Birds of Prey" -- might be fun. Doug would certainly blow the lid off of the "superheroes are urban legends" bit, though. Daylight is a good thing, tactically speaking...
I have completely missed out on seeing any "Firefly" whatsoever, but not for lack of interest. I did hear that it bears a strong resemblance to "Outlaw Star". I checked out the link, and saw a mention in the discussion groups of site where eps can be downloaded; maybe I'll go do that after the book is done.

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[offsides]

IMHO, as a big Outlaw Star fan (I have all 3 DVDs, and am vainly hoping that they'll make more of it ), the primary resemblance between the two shows is the overall feel of the universe. There are some serious parallels (River and Melfina being the biggest), and I can see the argument for major influence from OS, but it's not a direct steal. If anything, "Star Wars" is more of a steal from "The Hidden Fortress" than "Firefly" is to "Outlaw Star"...
It's a fun show, although I've fallen out of it somewhat since I'm rarely in front of a TV on Fridays anymore. I wish they'd shown the pilot first and let things flow fromt here, rather than juggling the episodes around and killing it (kinda like "Crusade"). And the Men In Blue Gloves get my vote for being the downright nastiest[i] villians I've seen in a long time.
"This one's dead."
"This one's not."

"Let's go."
[/i]Drunkard's Walk Forum Moderator and Prereader At Large

[Valles]

My notes say the download site is sharereactor.com/release.php?id=2699 .
It seems to be down just now - hopefully not permanently, since I was waiting to get back to TCNJ's T1 before I tried to pull them down.
Unfortunately, I don't watch TV much, and didn't even know Firefly -existed- until I came home and found my parents watching the Pilot.
Still, I saw River coming the instant I saw the fog coming out of the box.
Hell, I can see the two series taking place in the same universe only seperated by several hundred years of history.
Blessed be.
-n
===========

===============================================
"V, did you do something foolish?"
"Yes, and it was glorious."

[Bob Schroeck]

Yeah, that's it. After the 31st, I'll spend some time there.

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Ebony]

---

I've seen a couple eps of "Birds of Prey" -- might be fun. Doug would certainly blow the lid off of the "superheroes are urban legends" bit, though. Daylight is a good thing, tactically speaking...

---

Only if you can't see in the dark. Personally, I thought that what little I saw of BoP tried too hard to be a WB family-friendly drama and missed out on the point of the characters. Being rather familiar with the characters in the BoP comic, I felt that the TV portrayals were not only wrong, but at points downright stupid (she fights crime in lingerie for cryin' out loud!). My biggest problem is that the TV writers pretty much failed to grasp that there are two sides to DC's mainstream comics, as noted by their two flagship characters, Superman and Batman. Superman is in the daylight, out in the open, honest and true, and he can afford to be. He symbolizes the bright side of the Everyman, that part that says that you can succeed if you try hard enough, love your parents, and treat everyone fairly. Batman is the dark side of the Everyman; that part that comes out when the light side has been stomped on, exploited, and abused. The positive note is still there, but it's tempered with a sense that, sometimes, you have to get mean and scary to beat the "bad guys."
These two heroes general themes carry over to their settings as well. Gotham is supposed to be dark and seedy. Metropolis (and Smallville) are supposed to be lighter and cleaner. "Smallville" works well as a family drama, because Superman falls into the theme that WB uses. I like it a lot. "Birds of Prey" left me feeling like I was watching a parody.
Mind you, I only watched a little of it, and my opinions are based on an incomplete vision.
"Firefly," on the other hand, is a Space Western. And there's little in this world that I like more than a good alternate Western. What I've seen of it (first 3 episodes) made me very pleased with it. It also makes me want to beat the Fox programming execs over the head repeatedly for putting it in the Death Spot (a.k.a. Prime time on Friday night, where it has to compete with weekend events, movie openings, and the like).
Ebony the Black Dragon
Senior Editor, Living Room Games
www.lrgames.com
Ebony the Black Dragon
http://ebony14.livejournal.com

"Good night, and may the Good Lord take a Viking to you."

[Bob Schroeck]

Interesting analysis, Ebony -- I can't say I disagree with you. BTW, have you seen the excellent Batman/Catwoman fanfic series Cat Tales by Chris Dee, over at fanfiction.net? In the middle of a lot of other things, it touches a little on some of these issues. (It's also LOL funny in places. Highly recommended.)
I only managed to watch a few eps of "Birds of Prey" myself, but one of those was the pilot/first episode, and I have to say I was quite impressed. It was very nicely done, although I had some problems with how long the "superheroes are urban legends" belief would actually last with Batman regularly dropping off inmates at Arkham...

---

(she fights crime in lingerie for cryin' out loud!)

---

As opposed to the far more practical spandex? I seem to recall more than a few heroines and villainesses from comic books with similar tastes.
As for "Firefly", as I understand it, it was even further sabotaged by the fact that it was a serial story like Babylon 5, and it was broadcast out of order.


-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Ebony]

---

As opposed to the far more practical spandex? I seem to recall more than a few heroines and villainesses from comic books with similar tastes.

---

Speaking as a lapsed SCUBA diver, I can say that neoprene of varying thickness is a lot warmer than it looks, and makes good sense for a basic bodysuit for J. Random Superhero (although I'd probably go with a motorcycle helmet and leathers personally). In a world with comic-tech, ballistic cloth should be lightweight enough for costume duty. Wearing lingerie to fight crime is just asking for scrapes and a bad cold. This isn't Supermegatopia we're talking about, after all. It's Gotham.
Unfortunately, it's also network television, and as Mr. Theiss (I think that's his name; the costume designer for the original Star Trek) proved, titillation brings viewers.
Ebony the Black Dragon
Senior Editor, Living Room Games
www.lrgames.com
Ebony the Black Dragon
http://ebony14.livejournal.com

"Good night, and may the Good Lord take a Viking to you."

[Bob Schroeck]

As I recall, some fantasy descendant of neoprene was what was explicitly used for the Flash's outfit in the short-lived Flash TV series -- it wasn't originally a "superhero suit" at all, but something to help him regulate some of the extremes his accelerated metabolism could hit.
As for ballistic cloth, well, yeah. That's why I invented polykev for I.S.T., to give super characters that kind of protection without the bulk of a Second Chance vest.
And now that I think of it, maybe the Huntress is wearing ballistic lingerie...

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

"All my dainty underthings are made of kevlar." -- The Badger

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Ebony]

---

"All my dainty underthings are made of kevlar." -- The Badger

---

If you're going to quote my favorite MPD vigilante, I can no longer discount bulletproof lingerie. I miss First Comics. Oh, for the days of Norbert Sykes, Max Swell, Emily, Pierre, and all the others.
Ebony the Black Dragon
Senior Editor, Living Room Games
www.lrgames.com
Ebony the Black Dragon
http://ebony14.livejournal.com

"Good night, and may the Good Lord take a Viking to you."

[Bob Schroeck]

Sadly, when it was being published, Badger never interested me. I picked up the quote secondhand, long after its run ended. By then, of course, it was too late to be curious...

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Ebony]

---

Interesting analysis, Ebony -- I can't say I disagree with you. BTW, have you seen the excellent Batman/Catwoman fanfic series Cat Tales by Chris Dee, over at fanfiction.net? In the middle of a lot of other things, it touches a little on some of these issues. (It's also LOL funny in places. Highly recommended.)

---

Finally had a chance to read part of this. Nice and interesting. It also assumes something that comics companies don't want to do: that the characters, like real people, can grow and change and heal.
This really sold me:

---

Joker gave Francois de Poulignac the same wary-but-friendly, mustnt-spook-the-lunatic expression the orderlies always gave him at Arkham.
He pulled Bruce aside:
Brucie, reality check: Im wearing a purple suit?
Reluctantly, Bruce raised an eyebrow and gave a regretful half-nod.
Green hair?
Another grudging nod.
Kill people by the dozen.
Yep.
And the cheese-eating surrender monkey just called me a Puritan.
Yes.
Joker turned his head, seeming to process this information.
Well thats a first. He remarked finally.

---

Fun fun fun.
Ebony the Black Dragon
Senior Editor, Living Room Games
www.lrgames.com
Ebony the Black Dragon
http://ebony14.livejournal.com

"Good night, and may the Good Lord take a Viking to you."

[Bob Schroeck]

Yeah, that it is. Wait until you get to the wedding shower, or the latest installments (where Selina is trying to set Eddie up with Zatanna because they have some shared interests).
But in regards to this scene, I love the fact that for some chapters afterward, there are people wondering just what "cheese-eating surrender monkey" was supposed to mean. And that Joker's decided Bruce Wayne is his best friend, because they both have been betrayed by their women, and... well, I could go on. I just have so many favorite bits from Cat Tales -- "Coo-coo-ca-choo, Mrs. Robinson?", the bouquet from the Justice League, Alfred and the French chef next door, stuff like that.
Once again, for others reading: highly recommended.
(Edit: I can't believe I misspelled "next door".)

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Guest]

I was kind of enjoying Birds of Prey, having mostly seen it through taped episodes. I agree about the Huntress's outfits, that lacey coat was the killer.
But I read a collected book of the comics, so I probably didn't enjoy it as much as I could have. I guess I'm a purist. =P
I checked out Cat Tales, not having anything better to do late at night. They are good! Thanks for the recommendation. My favorite:
"They?ve been trying to get rid of him?? Dick sputtered. ?Like ?You are now safe to rejoin society; here?s your purple suit and spats, Mazel Tov???
Had me going for a while.

[drakensis]

Bwahahahaha! Nice fic!
Must read more!
D for Drakensis

You're only young once, but immaturity is forever.

[Bob Schroeck]

Thank Ed Becerra, who originally recommended it to me!

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

Oh, just found that the latest part, "Secrets", has a new chapter up! And, of course, a great line. (I won't give context. It's better that way.)

---

Bruce turned with a satisfied smirk into the judgmental stares of Selina, Dick and Barbara. After a beat, it was Dick who spoke: So another rogue is about to be hospitalized by the romantic advice of Bruce Wayne, Crimefighter Yenta.

---

You know, I'm starting to wonder if Dick Grayson is Jewish, with all the Yiddish he slings...
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Rod.H]

---

You know, I'm starting to wonder if Dick Grayson is Jewish, with all the Yiddish he slings...

---

Not necessary, he was a Rom circus brat after all, there would be bound to be someone Jewish working in the circus somewhere that he could pick up Yiddish from.
--Rod.H
"For some reason when I hear Celestine and Morgan Le Fay I keep on thinking: what's Roger Smith and R. Dorothy doing in Japan."

[Bob Schroeck]

I did intend that to be a bit tongue-in-cheek, you know...

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.