This isn't the sort of awesome quote usually submitted to this thread, but Ryuugi posted a very insightful Naruto informational post on why Sarutobi's actions may actually make sense with the proper context.
tl;dr - After Minato's death, Sarutobi had nobody capable of countering A or Onoki or any of their Jinchuriki and damn well knew it. Konoha had to bluff heavily to keep Oonoki from simply flying a mile over Konoha and aiming down with one of his mass damage AoE attacks.
https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/...-116547659
![[+]](/images/collapse_collapsed.png "[+]")
SpoilerTo anyone bringing up the potential explanation of Onoki refusing to attack Konoha because of fear of Edo Tensei*, or ambushes, or random geniuses, or magic eyes, or whatever else--
I think it needs to be mentioned, at least in passing, that Onoki did, in fact, go to war with Konoha multiple times.
And now, let's be clear here, everyone--
I'm not the one who wrote Sarutobi approaching exhaustion after something like five techniques and barely mustering two Shadow Clones by accepting his death, because he was old at 69, and then went 'Onoki can catch meteors and shoot island-destroying disintegration rays. As a treat.' when he was 79. I didn't write it that way. I'm also not the one who, given a chance to revive Sarutobi and give him infinite chakra and chances to show of, still didn't let him do much. I didn't write it, I didn't set it up that way, it's not my fault, okay? I'm out here doing the best with what I'm given. And so, if you're asking me how I'm gonna reconcile the fact that we gave one old man a doomsday weapon and another, younger man arthritis...then, look, I'm doing the best I can with what I'm given.
And you might say, it's simple--just say Sarutobi was that strong, too, but the thing is that canon does not function if Sarutobi has a nuke, too, unless Sarutobi is evil. The justifications for a lot of the things he does work, in my opinion, if you accept that he's in shit up to his ankles, and he's doing a handstand, but the Hyuuga Incident in canon, for example, doesn't work so well if we assume that Sarutobi has a meaningful chance against A in reality, despite all evidence. Because if he does, why is he so easily selling his shinobi's lives here so easily, you know? In order to justify the things Sarutobi does and allows, it's easiest to take things on their face, which is that shit sucks and he's doing his best.
So here's my best effort at handling a bad situation.
Based on the timeline, Onoki probably became Tsuchikage after the First War, taking the mantle from Mu. Why didn't Mu go kill everyone before that, as a stealth flying disintegration ray? He tried, but the Senju were around for part of his time and then he fell in battle with the Second Mizukage, which was lucky for everyone, because both of those guys were fucking death machines.
The Second Shinobi War, as we know from canon, was fought in the border countries like Ame and wrecked untold devastation therein, which was part of a desperate effort not to let...well, a whole bunch of faction reach each other's villages, because aside from Onoki, the Third Raikage should also have been around. Luckily for Konoha, this era had some standouts in it; the Sannin distinguished themselves, as did Sakumo, along with apparently Dan and probably a few others. Through a mix of these figures, from Dan's soul possession assassinations, Tsunade's massive improvements to Konoha's medical ninja, as well as ongoing conflicts with figures like Hanzo, who also rose to power, and the other villages, Konoha managed to survive this very harsh period of time after their two Super Saiyans died, and hold on through an immensely bloody conflict, which we see traces of the end of when Jiraiya meets the Ame orphans. It rough, it's bloody, and underneath the surface, it's kind of desperate, but Konoha got lucky and it's a World War, everyone against everyone, and they pulled through.
On careful observation, one might notice, however, that all of these figures--Jiraiya, Orochimaru, Tsunade, Sakumo, and Dan--are not around in Konoha by the modern day, for one reason or another. Most of them aren't even around by the start of the Third War, and only really Jiraiya's around and helping by the end.
The good news is, Konoha won the fucking lottery during the Third War, and got Minato. Under the surface, things were probably going really, really bad before Minato fully came into his power--we don't see a ton of the Third War, but we see a point relatively early on when a battered and beaten Team Jiraiya nearly gets annihilated because they ran into both of Iwa's Jinchuriki, who were dismissive of all of them, and they only survived because Minato used an early version of the Hiraishin to escape. Shit was going bad, but Minato did come into power, and he turned that shit around, devastating enemy forces until he got a flee on site order. He devastates Iwa in particular, forcing them to back down.
But Minato is also gone now. And if you ask the question of what Sarutobi is going to do if Onoki or A start getting ideas--be sure that he's asking himself that same question.
And, to be clear, along the way, he's doing the best he can. Genma and co are running constant missions to plant evidence of someone using the Hiraishin and then covering it up as best they can, with the expectation of A and Onoki digging deep enough to find it anyway and wonder if Konoha has another Minato, despite them only having the Teemu version in reality. Gai's running missions and using the Eight Gates periodically, to show that Konoha still has someone who can use it, even though he can probably only go up to five or maybe six. Kakashi's running around and Shisui's already in the field, because they have the skill and Sarutobi needs it, and Sarutobi pulls strings where he can. It'd be a lie to claim Sarutobi has the ability to puppet anyone, but he did do a lot to try to pit other villages against each other, so that someone paid the awful price of taking down the Third Raikage, and did things like set Sakumo on Suna to keep them from trying to interfere in the Second Tsuchikage and Mizukage's conflict, hoping and lucking out on them killing each other. There have been a lot of times when he wished he was playing chessmaster, but was actually desperately juggling jars of nitroglycerine, trying not to let them fall until a way out showed up, and let's be clear, a lot of people died along the way. Ame got fucked, because it was Ame or Konoha, and so it was Ame. That happened in plenty of other places to, and a lot of Konoha's children got sent to their deaths.
And, of course, Sarutobi gave Danzo a lot of leeway and a lot of power. Too much leeway and power, even for the time, with horrific, disastrous results. He accepted too many excuses, allowed too many ills, and was party to too many things, as a result. But the reason for that is, Sarutobi was in a bad spot, and needed all the help he could get, and had a lot of days where, if, like, this one guy near the Tsuchikage who keeps going 'Hey, I think Konoha's up to something, we should stop caring about Kumo and attack them instead' would just quietly choke to death on his own ballsack, it would really kind of help him out, and so if that happens, he just looks away and trusts the process, and he got used to trusting the process, even though the process was bad and trusting it made it worse.
And to be clear, Hiruzen did fight. He definitely picked his battles and wasn't ashamed of attacking people that just got out of another fight, or picking targets that were easy and framing another village for it, and what have you, but he had plenty of dangerous close calls, as well, and just had to manage.
But that's the best I can do without things twisting into eldritch knots. Again, and please remember this, I did not write it so that Sarutobi has to take four Viagra to be able to ejaculate dust, while Onoki eats a bowl of spinach and then belches loudly and blows up a mountain in the morning, you're gonna have to make some allowances here, guys.
*Also, people keep saying that all Orochimaru added to the Edo Tensei was the control mechanism? For one thing, Tobirama's still had the control mechanism, too--per his Birthday column, his primary use of it was reviving dead enemies and either interrogating them or giving them his special explosive tags and having them walk back behind enemy lines, because that's just the kind of guy Tobirama is. What we have no note of, however, was him using them for their own powers, but as mobile, regenerating bombs. Orochimaru figured out how to draw out some of their powers, and transformed them from bombs to soldiers, and Kabuto improved on that further. What's more, the revived Chiyo in chapter 521 notes how much Kabuto's improved the technique since Tobirama's day, in terms of the ridiculous amount he could summon and control at once, so the default use was probably more like Orochimaru's, where he pulls out two or three guys that are bombs with their friend's faces. Kabuto's at-will doomsday army is pretty far from the base-use.
...Also, while we're on the subject, it should also probably be mentioned that it's not like Konoha is the only village with Kinjutsu and secret shit, although Senju 'Warcrimes? I think you mean more crimes!' Tobirama made sure they had the best. But Deidara's mouth stuff mega bomb making thing is called out as being an Iwa Kinjutsu, for example. I assume there's only some many times you can send someone's crying son back home as a living bomb before a village starts investing in bomb development itself.
I think it needs to be mentioned, at least in passing, that Onoki did, in fact, go to war with Konoha multiple times.
And now, let's be clear here, everyone--
I'm not the one who wrote Sarutobi approaching exhaustion after something like five techniques and barely mustering two Shadow Clones by accepting his death, because he was old at 69, and then went 'Onoki can catch meteors and shoot island-destroying disintegration rays. As a treat.' when he was 79. I didn't write it that way. I'm also not the one who, given a chance to revive Sarutobi and give him infinite chakra and chances to show of, still didn't let him do much. I didn't write it, I didn't set it up that way, it's not my fault, okay? I'm out here doing the best with what I'm given. And so, if you're asking me how I'm gonna reconcile the fact that we gave one old man a doomsday weapon and another, younger man arthritis...then, look, I'm doing the best I can with what I'm given.
And you might say, it's simple--just say Sarutobi was that strong, too, but the thing is that canon does not function if Sarutobi has a nuke, too, unless Sarutobi is evil. The justifications for a lot of the things he does work, in my opinion, if you accept that he's in shit up to his ankles, and he's doing a handstand, but the Hyuuga Incident in canon, for example, doesn't work so well if we assume that Sarutobi has a meaningful chance against A in reality, despite all evidence. Because if he does, why is he so easily selling his shinobi's lives here so easily, you know? In order to justify the things Sarutobi does and allows, it's easiest to take things on their face, which is that shit sucks and he's doing his best.
So here's my best effort at handling a bad situation.
Based on the timeline, Onoki probably became Tsuchikage after the First War, taking the mantle from Mu. Why didn't Mu go kill everyone before that, as a stealth flying disintegration ray? He tried, but the Senju were around for part of his time and then he fell in battle with the Second Mizukage, which was lucky for everyone, because both of those guys were fucking death machines.
The Second Shinobi War, as we know from canon, was fought in the border countries like Ame and wrecked untold devastation therein, which was part of a desperate effort not to let...well, a whole bunch of faction reach each other's villages, because aside from Onoki, the Third Raikage should also have been around. Luckily for Konoha, this era had some standouts in it; the Sannin distinguished themselves, as did Sakumo, along with apparently Dan and probably a few others. Through a mix of these figures, from Dan's soul possession assassinations, Tsunade's massive improvements to Konoha's medical ninja, as well as ongoing conflicts with figures like Hanzo, who also rose to power, and the other villages, Konoha managed to survive this very harsh period of time after their two Super Saiyans died, and hold on through an immensely bloody conflict, which we see traces of the end of when Jiraiya meets the Ame orphans. It rough, it's bloody, and underneath the surface, it's kind of desperate, but Konoha got lucky and it's a World War, everyone against everyone, and they pulled through.
On careful observation, one might notice, however, that all of these figures--Jiraiya, Orochimaru, Tsunade, Sakumo, and Dan--are not around in Konoha by the modern day, for one reason or another. Most of them aren't even around by the start of the Third War, and only really Jiraiya's around and helping by the end.
The good news is, Konoha won the fucking lottery during the Third War, and got Minato. Under the surface, things were probably going really, really bad before Minato fully came into his power--we don't see a ton of the Third War, but we see a point relatively early on when a battered and beaten Team Jiraiya nearly gets annihilated because they ran into both of Iwa's Jinchuriki, who were dismissive of all of them, and they only survived because Minato used an early version of the Hiraishin to escape. Shit was going bad, but Minato did come into power, and he turned that shit around, devastating enemy forces until he got a flee on site order. He devastates Iwa in particular, forcing them to back down.
But Minato is also gone now. And if you ask the question of what Sarutobi is going to do if Onoki or A start getting ideas--be sure that he's asking himself that same question.
And, to be clear, along the way, he's doing the best he can. Genma and co are running constant missions to plant evidence of someone using the Hiraishin and then covering it up as best they can, with the expectation of A and Onoki digging deep enough to find it anyway and wonder if Konoha has another Minato, despite them only having the Teemu version in reality. Gai's running missions and using the Eight Gates periodically, to show that Konoha still has someone who can use it, even though he can probably only go up to five or maybe six. Kakashi's running around and Shisui's already in the field, because they have the skill and Sarutobi needs it, and Sarutobi pulls strings where he can. It'd be a lie to claim Sarutobi has the ability to puppet anyone, but he did do a lot to try to pit other villages against each other, so that someone paid the awful price of taking down the Third Raikage, and did things like set Sakumo on Suna to keep them from trying to interfere in the Second Tsuchikage and Mizukage's conflict, hoping and lucking out on them killing each other. There have been a lot of times when he wished he was playing chessmaster, but was actually desperately juggling jars of nitroglycerine, trying not to let them fall until a way out showed up, and let's be clear, a lot of people died along the way. Ame got fucked, because it was Ame or Konoha, and so it was Ame. That happened in plenty of other places to, and a lot of Konoha's children got sent to their deaths.
And, of course, Sarutobi gave Danzo a lot of leeway and a lot of power. Too much leeway and power, even for the time, with horrific, disastrous results. He accepted too many excuses, allowed too many ills, and was party to too many things, as a result. But the reason for that is, Sarutobi was in a bad spot, and needed all the help he could get, and had a lot of days where, if, like, this one guy near the Tsuchikage who keeps going 'Hey, I think Konoha's up to something, we should stop caring about Kumo and attack them instead' would just quietly choke to death on his own ballsack, it would really kind of help him out, and so if that happens, he just looks away and trusts the process, and he got used to trusting the process, even though the process was bad and trusting it made it worse.
And to be clear, Hiruzen did fight. He definitely picked his battles and wasn't ashamed of attacking people that just got out of another fight, or picking targets that were easy and framing another village for it, and what have you, but he had plenty of dangerous close calls, as well, and just had to manage.
But that's the best I can do without things twisting into eldritch knots. Again, and please remember this, I did not write it so that Sarutobi has to take four Viagra to be able to ejaculate dust, while Onoki eats a bowl of spinach and then belches loudly and blows up a mountain in the morning, you're gonna have to make some allowances here, guys.
*Also, people keep saying that all Orochimaru added to the Edo Tensei was the control mechanism? For one thing, Tobirama's still had the control mechanism, too--per his Birthday column, his primary use of it was reviving dead enemies and either interrogating them or giving them his special explosive tags and having them walk back behind enemy lines, because that's just the kind of guy Tobirama is. What we have no note of, however, was him using them for their own powers, but as mobile, regenerating bombs. Orochimaru figured out how to draw out some of their powers, and transformed them from bombs to soldiers, and Kabuto improved on that further. What's more, the revived Chiyo in chapter 521 notes how much Kabuto's improved the technique since Tobirama's day, in terms of the ridiculous amount he could summon and control at once, so the default use was probably more like Orochimaru's, where he pulls out two or three guys that are bombs with their friend's faces. Kabuto's at-will doomsday army is pretty far from the base-use.
...Also, while we're on the subject, it should also probably be mentioned that it's not like Konoha is the only village with Kinjutsu and secret shit, although Senju 'Warcrimes? I think you mean more crimes!' Tobirama made sure they had the best. But Deidara's mouth stuff mega bomb making thing is called out as being an Iwa Kinjutsu, for example. I assume there's only some many times you can send someone's crying son back home as a living bomb before a village starts investing in bomb development itself.
https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/...-116547659
“I really hope I’m behind this convoluted mess; at least that way I’ll be able to get revenge by doing this to myself. I won’t even have to feel bad because it’ll be all my fault.” - Harry Potter, The Master of Death by Ryuugi.