Dude, your post led off with how you think that the Muslim religion (as if there's just one) and culture (as if there's just one) are inherently worthless and inferior (as if that's even a meaningful comment when talking about cultures) to the west and that one or the other must be destroyed. Sure, I dismissed it out of hand beyond an offhand comment about a followup post that showed blatant ignorance of the factual history of Jewish relations with Muslim and Christian countries, for the exact same reason I would dismiss a similarly long and "researched" post about the inferiority of Hindus or Africans (and don't think the latter hasn't been done).
I could have rebut it point for point, but why bother? The very fact you think there is such a thing as a monolithic Muslim culture, or that being a Muslim means anything about how an individual or an entire country will or should act (and don't say you don't, when you literally, quote, said "no true coexistence is possible"), means we are utterly not on the same wavelength. Aside from the fact I consider it a horribly bigoted opinion to hold, my viewpoint is that you can explain why any given country/ethnic group is the way it is by looking at the factors that shape it, which in the Middle East's case only very, very tangentially has to do with it being predominantly Muslim (with several large minorities that aren't, like the ruling class of Maronite Christians in Lebanon, the Copts in Egypt, and so on).
Being Muslim means nothing, and there's nothing you'll ever say that will convince me otherwise. There is literally nothing a Muslim-ruled society invariably is. Muslim ruled societies have openly drank alcohol, been pacifistic, supported women's rights, been progressive, and been secular. Doesn't it seem far more likely, even to you, that the real reason the Middle East is relatively culturally backward and hostile to the West is because of actual political events rather than anything inherent in the religion?
And bluntly, don't use the word "fact" to describe crap posted from openly biased sources. If what you're posting is actually true you should be able to find it in sources that at least pay lip service to neutrality. If you can only find your facts on hard-right-wing sites, than you should consider giving those facts the same credence you would if I posted "facts" sourced only from MoveOn.org. Putting the fact that you consider the mainstream media to be left-wing-biased (and I consider it, in the US at least, to be very much the opposite) aside, there is still a difference between a biased source that attempts to be neutral and a source that is openly shilling for one side.
And of course I'm interested in viewpoints other than my own, or I wouldn't post on a message board. Honestly, Logan, the reason I don't show your viewpoints a lot of respect is two-fold:
1) You (and ECSNorway, and please forgive me if I occasionally conflate you since you often post essentially the same opinions and my memory is not perfect) do not give the same respect to others. My rather mild comments on the Somali pirates being as much victims as victimisers, for instance, got me told I was the worst person ever, or something to that effect. My posts have frequently been met with derision and insults regardless of the politeness of my tone. If that's actually just ECS and you have never done anything like that (but I'm pretty sure you both have), then I apologise. As well, you openly gloat when Democrats such as Obama do not live up to the ideals of their supporters, which is kind of rude.
(Edit: a quick browse over the forum shows that you have in fact responded to civil posts of mine with insults as far back as 2006, so I now feel pretty comfortable with this description of you, as well as old.)
2) Bluntly, you hold extremely across-the-board straight talking point US right-wing opinions. You don't like Muslims, think global warming is a hoax dreamed up by those sneaky scientists, oppose affirmative action, decry "political correctness", you honestly believe the Democratic party of the US promotes left-wing policies, you think Californians are wacky and Texans sensible, love your guns, you believe in US exceptionalism, you unconditionally support Israel, and so on and so forth. It is hard for me to believe you think through your opinions, even aside from your predilection to posting links to "facts" from right-wing conspiracy sites, when your position on any topic conforms so absolutely to your party's line. Though, I'll give you credit and note you aren't actually a Creationist, at least (but neither are most classic pro-business Republicans; it's an import from the religious right).
I don't hold across-the-board "correct" left-wing views (I support certain uses of the military and a reasonable amount of spending, I support sustainable hunting of any wild animal population including whales and cute baby seals, I think laws passed to protect people from themselves are usually harmful, I don't think much of organic farming, and so on and so forth) and consider people that do to be cartoons who don't think for themselves and instead are doing the political equivalent of cheering for their favourite sports team. And you and ECS seem much the same way. I'm sorry about that; I really am, because I think it's unfortunate you feel so frustrated. But I'm not going to lie to you - and I think it's far more unfortunate that I don't really see in your positions any evidence that you've thought them through very carefully and kept an open mind. I don't know you and of course I could be wrong - and of course, you think I am, and I rather doubt anything I say will change that.
But come on, man. The Democrats as a hard left-wing party? Let's be fucking serious here. The very fact there is a left wing within the Democrats railing against how the laws the party passes aren't very left-wing should be sufficient to prove that, even if you never compare the Democratic platform to the platform of any other left-wing party in the world.
I could have rebut it point for point, but why bother? The very fact you think there is such a thing as a monolithic Muslim culture, or that being a Muslim means anything about how an individual or an entire country will or should act (and don't say you don't, when you literally, quote, said "no true coexistence is possible"), means we are utterly not on the same wavelength. Aside from the fact I consider it a horribly bigoted opinion to hold, my viewpoint is that you can explain why any given country/ethnic group is the way it is by looking at the factors that shape it, which in the Middle East's case only very, very tangentially has to do with it being predominantly Muslim (with several large minorities that aren't, like the ruling class of Maronite Christians in Lebanon, the Copts in Egypt, and so on).
Being Muslim means nothing, and there's nothing you'll ever say that will convince me otherwise. There is literally nothing a Muslim-ruled society invariably is. Muslim ruled societies have openly drank alcohol, been pacifistic, supported women's rights, been progressive, and been secular. Doesn't it seem far more likely, even to you, that the real reason the Middle East is relatively culturally backward and hostile to the West is because of actual political events rather than anything inherent in the religion?
And bluntly, don't use the word "fact" to describe crap posted from openly biased sources. If what you're posting is actually true you should be able to find it in sources that at least pay lip service to neutrality. If you can only find your facts on hard-right-wing sites, than you should consider giving those facts the same credence you would if I posted "facts" sourced only from MoveOn.org. Putting the fact that you consider the mainstream media to be left-wing-biased (and I consider it, in the US at least, to be very much the opposite) aside, there is still a difference between a biased source that attempts to be neutral and a source that is openly shilling for one side.
And of course I'm interested in viewpoints other than my own, or I wouldn't post on a message board. Honestly, Logan, the reason I don't show your viewpoints a lot of respect is two-fold:
1) You (and ECSNorway, and please forgive me if I occasionally conflate you since you often post essentially the same opinions and my memory is not perfect) do not give the same respect to others. My rather mild comments on the Somali pirates being as much victims as victimisers, for instance, got me told I was the worst person ever, or something to that effect. My posts have frequently been met with derision and insults regardless of the politeness of my tone. If that's actually just ECS and you have never done anything like that (but I'm pretty sure you both have), then I apologise. As well, you openly gloat when Democrats such as Obama do not live up to the ideals of their supporters, which is kind of rude.
(Edit: a quick browse over the forum shows that you have in fact responded to civil posts of mine with insults as far back as 2006, so I now feel pretty comfortable with this description of you, as well as old.)
2) Bluntly, you hold extremely across-the-board straight talking point US right-wing opinions. You don't like Muslims, think global warming is a hoax dreamed up by those sneaky scientists, oppose affirmative action, decry "political correctness", you honestly believe the Democratic party of the US promotes left-wing policies, you think Californians are wacky and Texans sensible, love your guns, you believe in US exceptionalism, you unconditionally support Israel, and so on and so forth. It is hard for me to believe you think through your opinions, even aside from your predilection to posting links to "facts" from right-wing conspiracy sites, when your position on any topic conforms so absolutely to your party's line. Though, I'll give you credit and note you aren't actually a Creationist, at least (but neither are most classic pro-business Republicans; it's an import from the religious right).
I don't hold across-the-board "correct" left-wing views (I support certain uses of the military and a reasonable amount of spending, I support sustainable hunting of any wild animal population including whales and cute baby seals, I think laws passed to protect people from themselves are usually harmful, I don't think much of organic farming, and so on and so forth) and consider people that do to be cartoons who don't think for themselves and instead are doing the political equivalent of cheering for their favourite sports team. And you and ECS seem much the same way. I'm sorry about that; I really am, because I think it's unfortunate you feel so frustrated. But I'm not going to lie to you - and I think it's far more unfortunate that I don't really see in your positions any evidence that you've thought them through very carefully and kept an open mind. I don't know you and of course I could be wrong - and of course, you think I am, and I rather doubt anything I say will change that.
But come on, man. The Democrats as a hard left-wing party? Let's be fucking serious here. The very fact there is a left wing within the Democrats railing against how the laws the party passes aren't very left-wing should be sufficient to prove that, even if you never compare the Democratic platform to the platform of any other left-wing party in the world.