COVID-19 & US healthcare system - thread relapse

[hazard]

It's not helped by the exceedingly mixed if not outright counterproductive messaging of the American government, with the federal and state governments at odds with eachother in many states.

I would not be surprised however that, now that the virus has had time to spread across the USA and certain areas reopening themselves in spite of lack of insight in the virus' spread, there will be a spike in pneumonia and similar lung illnesses claiming lives over the next month.

[Star Ranger4]

I would say that its us americans doing it to ourselves by being the ornery 'don't tell US what to do' people who told England to sod off when they stopped ignoring us and started taxing us again.

[Labster]

US “terminating relationship” with World Health Organization, Trump says

It's like Brexit, only 10 times dumber.

[Matrix Dragon]

When in doubt, racism and idiot conspiracy theories. Hey, it's worked for him for decades.

[Labster]

Since Trump never actually ordered anything closed, he can't order anything back open.

Unless...

And this is crazy town...

So in 2007, Congress in their wisdom decided to give the President the authority to invoke martial law in states and take direct control of their National Guard without the consent of the governors. It has to be a situation in which a right enumerated in the Constitution where the governor cannot or will not enforce that right. So, freedom of assembly? Prohibiting the free exercise of religion? Stopping the right to bear arms by closing gun stores? I think the legal right is probably there. Martial law has been used in the U.S. in the past to get people to return to work, like in the SF dockworkers strike.

The only downside to this idea is starting a civil war in the middle of a pandemic, so there is that.

Welcome to crazy town, folks!  AG Barr says state orders for containing COVID-19 may violate Constitution.  So here's our Attorney General trying to lay the groundwork for this, in a move that is classic Barr.  Does Trump want him to to this?  Probably not, or maybe only some days of the week.  But dollars to donuts AG Barr has the same crackpot idea I had *and* he also thinks it's a good idea.

And in terms of the strikebreaking idea, Trump has just ordered slaughterhouses and meat packing plants to reopen -- the ones that have been closed because of large scale epidemics among the workers.  Unions are not happy about the life-threatening conditions at work.  But hey, maybe we can consider The Jungle a futuristic book now?

Fucking called it.  Welcome to the jungle.

We saw it with our own eyes: Trump wants to go to war against America

[SilverFang01]

A 70-year-old man in Seattle survived the coronavirus, got applauded by staff when he left the hospital after 62 days -- and then got a $1.1 million, 181-page hospital bill.

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-new...ital-bill/

[Star Ranger4]

... Don't suppose those news outlets will make themselves look good by donating to that cause. Otherwise it does not surprise me, given the state of privatized health care here in the US.

[LynnInDenver]

Yeah, the irony is the whole idea of "making us have skin in the game" in terms of trying to get people to take care of their health and do proper risk management, tends to fall apart pretty hard with factors outside our personal control, like, um, GENETIC LOTTERY (especially since we don't have anything yet other than family health history to refer to for too many of these issues) and OTHER PEOPLE'S LACK OF RISK MANAGEMENT. And it's been (deliberately) compounded by the rapidly spiraling health costs, practically ensuring that one will be financially ruined for at least ten years if they do get ill from losing the genetic lottery or smacked from the outside by someone else's mistakes.

[robkelk]

Cory Doctorow took part in an online chat in late April to promote Canada Reads. He ended with a political statement:

I live in Burbank, which is in Los Angeles County, but is its own city, separate from Los Angeles (like North York and Toronto were, pre-amalgamation — I can see the Los Angeles city line from my house).

We're getting a front-row seat for a stress-test of the limits and power of the U.S. system of federalism, with California asserting a wide latitude of autonomy from the federal authorities (the federal response, needless to say, has been a catastrophic failure that may yet bring the country down) — and moreover, California is joining forces with other states in the region to form a single block. That's really weird, as is the reversal of the left and right's position on "state's rights" with Trump asserting that states have NO right to assert independence in the face of federal authority, and the left insisting that states have broad latitude to act (normally it's the other way around with the right asserting that states can engage in racially or gender-based discriminatory conduct, ban abortion, etc).

What will be really wild is what may come of this after the next federal election, in which the new Democratic president could use the strong federal powers that Trump could get the Supreme Court to agree to to enact gun control, abortion rights and antidiscrimination rules that overrule state governments.

I have been paying attention to Canada as well. It's certainly more functional than the U.S.

The thing that both Canada and the U.S. are getting wrong, most of all, is being too timid with stimulus. They are sovereign currency issuers whose debts are denominated in their own currencies. They should be conjuring up TRILLIONS more, and nationalising the payroll of every struggling business, keeping those workers employed so they can return to work when the crisis ends. This should come with conditions for employers (good conduct orders that ban discriminatory conduct, structured bankruptcies, dividends, stock buybacks, etc), and should be capped at a sum sufficient for payroll employees to pay rent/mortgages and buy groceries and other necessities. The inflationary risk is minimal: it won't raise the cost of labour, nor will it put more dollars into circulation to bid up the price of goods — it will simply replace the dollars that have ceased to circulate in order to pay for goods that are still being produced and debts/liabilities (mortgages/rents) that are still owed.

(Okay, he ended with two political statements, because his actual final words in the chat were a request that everybody taking part delete their Facebook accounts. Yes, the chat was on Facebook. But that's a completely different discussion.)

[Labster]

What will be really wild is what may come of this after the next federal election, in which the new Democratic president could use the strong federal powers that Trump could get the Supreme Court to agree to to enact gun control, abortion rights and antidiscrimination rules that overrule state governments.

Okay, I get that you're really smart Cory but this is almost incoherent in terms of political understanding.  Politicians are always in favor of central powers when their people are in and devolved powers when their people are out.  Like, sure, a Democratic president could get strict gun control with a conservative Supreme Court and a rich, vocal minority who opposes?  They will cry violation of states rights so fast and loud your ears will hurt, since no one cares about logical consistency.

I have been paying attention to Canada as well. It's certainly more functional than the U.S.

The thing that both Canada and the U.S. are getting wrong, most of all, is being too timid with stimulus. They are sovereign currency issuers whose debts are denominated in their own currencies. They should be conjuring up TRILLIONS more, and nationalising the payroll of every struggling business, keeping those workers employed so they can return to work when the crisis ends. This should come with conditions for employers (good conduct orders that ban discriminatory conduct, structured bankruptcies, dividends, stock buybacks, etc), and should be capped at a sum sufficient for payroll employees to pay rent/mortgages and buy groceries and other necessities. The inflationary risk is minimal: it won't raise the cost of labour, nor will it put more dollars into circulation to bid up the price of goods — it will simply replace the dollars that have ceased to circulate in order to pay for goods that are still being produced and debts/liabilities (mortgages/rents) that are still owed.

This, on the other hand, makes lots of sense.  You can't cause inflation in a liquidity crisis.  You can't cause inflation in a liquidity crisis, really.  The economy wants more dollars, give it more dollars.  This, of course, will still never happen because it's still a massive transfer of wealth to the middle class, and America is not a communist country or something.

“I feel guilty about surviving,” he says. “There’s a sense of ‘why me?’ Why did I deserve all this? Looking at the incredible cost of it all definitely adds to that survivor’s guilt.”

See?  We're so anti-socialist that people feel guilty about getting their health care paid for when they get a disease by accident.  This is the whole point of insurance, to spread risk, and here's a person who feels bad about simply surviving.

[hazard]

European nation's general response to Michael Flor's question?

"You are a person. Not a citizen of this state, not a citizen of this nation, not in good standing, not in poor standing, nothing but a person who needed help. And we refuse to deny it, nor access to it, to anyone, on any ground other than their own, explicit declaration that they refuse treatment."

[Labster]

... unless you're a person from Syria, in which case gtfo Mooslim infidel.

Okay, that's a little glib.  I've been thinking about "The Weight" by Robbie Robinson for a while.  It's about the fundamental problem of living that we cannot do all that is asked of us.  We cannot always be good.  And that manifests as the problem of sin in that we could always be better.  So it's good that Europe in general believes in the person; but actually helping all humans in need, even in your country, is a problem that is always beyond our grasp.

[hazard]

Lab, racism is not alien to us, I'm sad to say. But to my knowledge, in the Netherlands, the racism of certain parties aside, nobody may be denied medical care. Not even asylum seekers who have exhausted all legal resources available to them to plead for the right to stay permanently or extend their asylum, loathed as they are in certain corners of the political spectrum.

Should the patient be unable to pay the cost of treatment the state will take up the bill. Some would say that's a waste of taxpayer money, but those fools do not understand how much cheaper it is than the alternative.

[Labster]

Well, looks like the U.S. has given up on the coronavirus.  Thrown in the towel.  We're in stage 3 reopening, moving fast into the final stage 4, as infection cases surge to their highest levels yet.  A lot of people are going to die.  But hey, at least it won't be for nothing, they'll die creating shareholder value.

We've left the World Health Organization, because why bother to fight the disease?  The President is planning large rallies in states like Oklahoma, Texas, and Arizona -- all states where the infections are surging.  But what can we do?  If he doesn't get the adoration he is entitled to as President, he gets really mad and starts setting up concentration camps for immigrants and attacking citizens with some unidentified police.  We don't want more of that.

And, well, maybe it should be expected of a nation so willing to oppress its own people, people so unwilling to share the costs of health care, willing to tolerate thousands of gun deaths a year.  Back in the 1990s, we talked about the Pax Americana.  And like the Pax Romana, at the heart of it is a culture making spectacle out of violence.

[robkelk]

And you'll let tourists fly into your country, too.

At least the border's still closed going in the other direction.

[SilverFang01]

During a pandemic. These people are just straight up evil.

Trump asks SCOTUS to invalidate ACA.

[SilverFang01]

Texas' Largest Hospital Reaches 100 Percent ICU Capacity

Well, it seems the governor will get his wish of people dying for The Dow.

[Labster]

White House ordered NIH to cancel coronavirus research funding

And this was not a mistake before the pandemic, made in hindsight. This was during the pandemic, in April, that they cut research funding into coronavirii. And only because of orders from the top.

[SilverFang01]

Three new papers quantify how conservative media outlets like Fox News misled their viewers in the early days of the pandemic, showing how that misinformation may have discouraged protective behavior and worsened the severity of the outbreak
New research explores how conservative media misinformation may have intensified the severity of the pandemic

[SilverFang01]

This coronavirus mutation has taken over the world. Scientists are trying to understand why.

The virus has unlocked an achievement, now becoming more infectious. Like it needed the help.

Also, the lead researcher's name. Wonder if there is a relation?

[classicdrogn]

Also, the lead researcher's name. Wonder if there is a relation?

Perhaps a middle name starting with G?

[hazard]

Okay, who is playing Plague Inc?

[Star Ranger4]

More like, as my Niece noted yesterday, not enough people have played (and lost at) Pandemic

[Labster]

Yes, Los Angeles keeps coming to the top of the deck, it looks like Milan got shuffled lower last time.

[SilverFang01]

Potential Long-term effects of COVID-19