I just had a flash of inspiration...

[Bob Schroeck]

... for a scene at the Ministry Battle at the end of DW8 that I simply can't write -- because it won't let anyone else have any fun, and that's not how I'm rolling in this story.  It goes something like this:

Doug walks into an atrium filled with all the Death Eaters, grins, and says, "System.  'Bad Apple'.  Play."  Fast cut to the ministry janitorial staff cleaning up the resulting mess.

(I suspect I don't have to footnote that for anyone here, but just in case I'm wrong, see here for an idea what would happen.  <grin>)

[hazard]

... Not what I'm getting from that song.

'Crushing despair'? Yes, I'm getting that from the lyrics. But not 'bullet hell'.

And IIRC, Doug's subconscious may have a bit of whimsy, but the effect of the song always refers back to the lyrics of the song itself, even if only in a thematic sense and oblique angel.

[Bob Schroeck]

This is true. But it's the only Touhou related song that I know of, and I was feeling a whimsical inspiration that yes, did not actually fit the lyrics. It's not like I was serious -- giving Doug this kind of power blows the top right off the "rules of balance" I write by.

That said, I just found a video (while reading the EPU forums) which might give an idea of the effect; some mad genius actually did a 3D render of what these battles look like from inside. Now imagine Doug as the source of these storms of magical projectiles, and at the other end are a couple hundred guys who think magical combat means mostly standing in place (with a little dodging and jogging) and waving a stick to fire a single shot every couple of seconds, and you get a sense of what I was chuckling about over half an hour ago.

[hazard]

A couple hundred?

I never got the sense that the Ministry Battle was that big. A dozen Death Eaters? Sure, but not much more than that.


Also, yes, that does rather give the sense of, say, a bunch of bolt action equipped riflemen facing off against a modern day rapid fire 20 or 30mm equipped SPAAG. It really doesn't end well for the infantry once the SPAAG decides to tell them to get lost.

[classicdrogn]

minusT has in fact done an entire series of those videos, and that isn't even the craziest one. (That would be the next one, Subterranean Stars... at least so far. The most recent teaser shows the upcoming one as being four or possibly five teams of two taking each other on...)

[Bob Schroeck]

A couple hundred?

I never got the sense that the Ministry Battle was that big. A dozen Death Eaters? Sure, but not much more than that.

The canon Ministry battle was, yeah, a dozen Death Eaters plus Voldemort at the end (and any entourage he may have brought with him).

Let's just say things will go differently and Lord Emo gets pissed sufficiently to send in everyone he can summon as a second wave. (Think also of the movies and the size of the force he had besieging Hogwarts. Admittedly a fair number of them were likely to have been post-takeover recruits and possibly some Continental wands-for-hire, but even so, his base forces were well over a dozen.)

[nemonowan]

Still, "99 Red Balloons" could be used as a poor-man's canonical version of this, IIRC.

[Bob Schroeck]

This is true... but for only 99 shots.

Edit: Which, yes, is why it's a "poor man's version".

[itsune9tl]

I would have thought that 99 red balloons was a defensive song as it swamped an area with 100 targets, only one of which is real. Any damage done was collateral from every thing else attacking the wrong target...
If you want to go Bullet Hell "Tommy Gun" by Royal Republic is a much better song for it. On the balance side of things Doug is in the middle of that mess.

[Bob Schroeck]

Oh no, "99 Red Balloons" is well-established over the years as a very offensive song. It produces Doug's choice of mix of 99 tiny jet fighters and ICBMs -- and the ICBMs are micronukes. One of the very oldest teaser threads for DW8 actually has a scenelet -- currently in limbo regarding the story as it is now plotted -- showing him using it. And Rob's used it in his unfinished Stagger, "Blue Sky, Blue Water".

[hazard]

Well, with hundreds of Death Eaters in the fray, and knowing Doug, plenty of casualties who will need long term care or an undertaker, that's going to gut the pureblood supremacy movement.

First, because so many of their supporters will be known terrorists. Second, because so many will not be able to support it physically even if they survive.

[Bob Schroeck]

<smiles knowingly>

[Labster]

I always got the feeling that the wizards don't want to realize that they're in a war. It's just a few rogue elements, and we wouldn't really need to kill anyone. That, of course, doesn't apply to the other side, which is how we know they're Evil. We definitely wouldn't wantonly kill non-muggles. No, our side of civilization simply sends wizards to years of terror in Azkaban, where they can learn the error of their ways betwixt the screaming.

Doug on the other hand will, and his relative eagerness to employ lethal methods against people trying to kill him will shock the wizards around him.

Also that 3D render of fighting in a bullet hell is freaking amazing!

[hazard]

A part of it, I think, is the small numbers the wizards have.

When a single year of Hogwarts students would be lucky to scratch around 100 students they just don't have that many people, even if on the average they live long. Wizarding population numbers, going by canon at least, would not get even close to 100 000 people in the whole of the UK at a guess. In such a case, even a dozen dead is a tragedy and a major blow to wizarding society.

[Bob Schroeck]

I always got the feeling that the wizards don't want to realize that they're in a war.  It's just a few rogue elements, and we wouldn't really need to kill anyone.  That, of course, doesn't apply to the other side, which is how we know they're Evil.  We definitely wouldn't wantonly kill non-muggles.  No, our side of civilization simply sends wizards to years of terror in Azkaban, where they can learn the error of their ways betwixt the screaming.

Doug on the other hand will, and his relative eagerness to employ lethal methods against people trying to kill him will shock the wizards around him.

Heh.

"Albus, don't be a damned fool. There is a major moral difference
between murder and killing an enemy in self-defense or the defense
of others. Even the great religions make the distinction,
regardless of how later translators may have muddied the issue."

Albus frowned. "One cannot remain of the Light and take the life
of another person."

I made a chopping motion with my hand. "That's bullshit, and I'm
surprised you believe it. To take the life of another out of
simple hatred, or for personal gain, or for *pleasure* -- yeah,
these are evil acts. But taking down someone who is about to
kill or torture another, there is no evil there."

"I'm sure that your history as a soldier leads you to believe..."
Albus began condescendingly.

"Screw my history," I interrupted him. "Look at the *math*, if
nothing else. If your enemy kills one of you in every encounter,
and all you do is inconvenience them, your side is gonna run out
of folks a *lot* faster than theirs will."

Albus leaned forward. "We cannot claim to be of the right if we
abandon our ethics and civilization to lower ourselves to their
level. We must testify to the superiority of our position by
tempering our defense with unalloyed mercy, for the enemy you
kill is the enemy who cannot repent." He leaned back and sternly
added, "And it is better by far that we die than betray the
ethics that guide us."

I stared incredulously at him. "You can *not* be serious."

Albus stared down his broken nose at me. "I assure you, Douglas,
I am."

I snorted. "Then this is only some kind of sick game for you,
and you can't really intend to defeat Voldemort. Handicapping
your forces in that way *guarantees* he will win, because your
people will die by violence *much* faster than his will by
accident, disease or old age.

"Refusing to defend yourself to your full ability in the face of
evil is suicidal foolishness, Albus -- and I can tell you from
certain knowledge that in the afterlife the gods punish fools as
harshly as they punish the evil."

"Nevertheless, Douglas, I forbid you to advocate lethal measures
to the children."

"No."

He blinked. "I beg your pardon?"

"What I said. No. I will not stop."

"Douglas..."

"I will not censor my lessons because *you* are squeamish. I
would be betraying my students and guaranteeing their deaths at
the hands of *your* enemies."

"If you do not comply with my request, Douglas, I will be forced to
terminate your contract."

"You and I both know you won't do that."

"Pray tell, why?'

"Umbridge."

Albus grimaced.

I nodded. "I'm the only thing keeping her in check, mainly by
making myself a bigger target than you or Potter, and by using my
metatalents to thwart her where I can. You kick me out of the
castle, she not only gets free rein to make your life *and*
Potter's hell, the Ministry will slot her right into the Defense
professorship. We both know that you don't want that."

He gritted his teeth. "No. I do not," he ground out
reluctantly.

Also that 3D render of fighting in a bullet hell is freaking amazing!

It is, isn't it?

[Labster]

Oh man, what ever happened to academic freedom?

Did I inspire that?

[DHBirr]

"...ever since Akhnaton ruled in Egypt, probably since even before then, a school of thought has held we ought to lay down our weapons and rely on love.  That, if love doesn't work, at least we'll die guiltless.  Usually even its opponents have said this is a noble idea.  I say it stinks.  I say it's not just unrealistic, not just infantile, it's evil.  It denies we have any duty to act in this life.  Because how can we, if we let go of our capability?"
— Ensign Flandry, 1966 by Poul Anderson; lecture by Flandry's mentor

-----
I'm a very forgiving person ... on Lord Vader's terms.  "Apology accepted, Captain."

[Bob Schroeck]

Oh man, what ever happened to academic freedom?

Did I inspire that?

Oh, no, that scene's been around for years.

[ckosacranoid]

If nothing else the song by Priss.....Rock you like a hurricane would be pretty cool to let loose in the building...it might help them clean things up better in the wizard world.

[DHBirr]

If nothing else the song by Priss.....Rock you like a hurricane would be pretty cool to let loose in the building...it might help them clean things up better in the wizard world.

Ahhhh, "Rock You Like a Hurricane" is by Scorpions; Priss's song is "Konya wa Hurricane," which according to the source DWII used translates as "Tonight Is a Hurricane."

-----
“We’ve had our differences, but he’s seen the light … and I made sure he moved toward it, instead of coming back.”

[Bob Schroeck]

...and which already has a canon power expression, as seen at the end of DWII.

[ckosacranoid]

Talk about dealing with voldy though with some big power....

[Star Ranger4]

... for a scene at the Ministry Battle at the end of DW8 that I simply can't write -- because it won't let anyone else have any fun, and that's not how I'm rolling in this story.  It goes something like this:

Doug walks into an atrium filled with all the Death Eaters, grins, and says, "System.  'Bad Apple'.  Play."  Fast cut to the ministry janitorial staff cleaning up the resulting mess.

(I suspect I don't have to footnote that for anyone here, but just in case I'm wrong, see here for an idea what would happen.  <grin>)

Whereas I have a feeling you've been reading too much EPU.



Thhhhbbbbbpppppptttttt

[Bob Schroeck]

Heh.

Well, just allow me to note that this is yet another case where this applies. I haven't decided yet who gets trained by Marisa Kirisame, but rest assured, someone will.

[ckosacranoid]

That set up there is only one thing to do with the fight in the Ministry. For Doug to do the bugs bunny things and slap Tommy boy with a glove and then say this means war.