All The Tropes Wiki Project, Part XXI

[robkelk]

On another topic entirely, I just noticed that Hollywood Apocrypha cleverly uses tabber to put the self-demonstrating and plain English versions both on the same page.  Anyone have objections to me doing the same for Finnegans Wake?

Feel free!

And "Canada, eh?" should get the same treatment.

The French version of Canada, eh? is handled as a page in our French language version... I'm not sure I want to break the organization there.

Good point.

And I don't know whether either of the subpages currently listed here really are self-demonstrating...

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I noticed that our page for Cab Calloway kept telling people to listen to particular songs, so I added links to as many as I could find in the Internet Archive.

Do we have pages for any other singers that would benefit from the same treatment? Keep in mind that the Internet Archive tends to have only out-of-copyright material.

[Bob Schroeck]

At some point I'll check all of them.

EDIT: The Self-Demonstrating Pages, I mean. Although the Cab Calloway links will make for a nice start to an evening as well.

[GethN7]

Did some reading on the Fate/Stay Night page bug

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Fate/stay_night

We need to change the title of the URL link by moving the page to something like "Fate Stay Night" for the bug to resolve via DISPLAYTITLE magic word markup.

[GethN7]

There seems to be breakage of Lua, resulting in this error

Lua error in Module:Subpages_5 at line 119: attempt to index local 'tobj' (a nil value)

It does not seem to affect all pages, and the code it links to indicates the problem is due to Lua itself acting up, which is a backend issue beyond our purview.

Hopefully, this is temporary, but if the problem persists, we will need to ask Miraheze Staff to look into it.

Update: Fixed the issue by disabling MyVariables.The new magic words would be useful and are indeed harmless. However, both extensions use this parser hook:

https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Ho...stCallInit

The Lua template to call key sections of the Module that had issues requires absolute priority usage of that hook, which MyVariables wants to have sole usage of too. Unfortunately, instead of both sharing usage, they get into a catfight which MyVariables wins, thus breaking the Lua templating.

Ergo, no MyVariables unless we want to break Lua.

[Bob Schroeck]

Did some reading on the Fate/Stay Night page bug

We need to change the title of the URL link by moving the page to something like "Fate Stay Night" for the bug to resolve via DISPLAYTITLE magic word markup.

Can't see any reason not to do it...

EDIT: And I did, and despite the new stuff being installed, DISPLAYTTITLE still rejects the insertion of the slash. I'm leaving the move as-is until we can thrash this out properly.

And I note that we have a few other Fate Series pages all screwed up under "Fate", including Fate/hollow ataraxia and its subpages.

[GethN7]

Did some reading on the Fate/Stay Night page bug

We need to change the title of the URL link by moving the page to something like "Fate Stay Night" for the bug to resolve via DISPLAYTITLE magic word markup.

Can't see any reason not to do it...

EDIT:  And I did, and despite the new stuff being installed, DISPLAYTTITLE still rejects the insertion of the slash.  I'm leaving the move as-is until we can thrash this out properly.

And I note that we have a few other Fate Series pages all screwed up under "Fate", including Fate/hollow ataraxia and its subpages.

Sent Brent the deets via Discord, seems it PARTIALLY works in the page text itself, but the Lua module for the subpages is what is throwing a fit for the canonical URL/page name, but not sure if it will forward properly to new subpages, asked him to check that.

Specifically, the module code already calls for a DISPLAYTITLE reference, and that warning we get is because the page is playing along, but the subpage module not wanting to completely play ball.

[robkelk]

Did some reading on the Fate/Stay Night page bug

We need to change the title of the URL link by moving the page to something like "Fate Stay Night" for the bug to resolve via DISPLAYTITLE magic word markup.

Can't see any reason not to do it...

EDIT:  And I did, and despite the new stuff being installed, DISPLAYTTITLE still rejects the insertion of the slash.  I'm leaving the move as-is until we can thrash this out properly.

And I note that we have a few other Fate Series pages all screwed up under "Fate", including Fate/hollow ataraxia and its subpages.

Likewise Fate/EXTELLA: The Umbral Star and Fate/EXTRA, and their subpages... which I won't move until the issues with Fate/stay night are worked out.

EDIT: If only we didn't have that disambiguation page for "Fate"... but then where would we distinguish between Fate and Prophecy Tropes and Fate Testarossa? We may need to break our own Style Guide and call that page "Fate (disambiguation)"...

[Umbire]

No cheating in a Unicode slash or something similar?

[GethN7]

No cheating in a Unicode slash or something similar?

That MIGHT be possible, actually:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:...characters

Wikipedia notes MediaWiki limitations here.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slash_(pun...)#Encoding

Might be able to cheat via this.

I asked Brent to look into this for his Work template's Lua scripting, to make sure there are no conflicts, but best I could find so far.

I did, however, notice something interesting. Wikipedia does NOT allow mainspace to have subpages, but we do, but given how our wiki is structured, we have to do that. Worse comes to worst, if we have no choice, we'd have to make the Fate page a catchall disambiguation page for all pages starting with that and keep "Fate/" in the page titles of the Fate/ franchise pages to avoid too severe a breakage and/or conflict of the Lua templates while compromising on this technical limitation.

[Black Aeronaut]

Anyone know if we can use this for Get It Off Me?  Because it's a damn-near perfect example of this trope in action.  (Especially that LOOK Megatron gives Starscream here -- that picture perfect "Are you an idiot?" look.)

[GethN7]

Anyone know if we can use this for Get It Off Me?  Because it's a damn-near perfect example of this trope in action.  (Especially that LOOK Megatron gives Starscream here -- that picture perfect "Are you an idiot?" look.)

If it's only the portion sufficient to display the trope, under fair use, that would pass muster.

[GethN7]

Finally wrote up that proposed policy page on best practices for Tabs and Tabber. If there are any other extensions where we need to use them in specific ways for formatting reasons, I would not be averse to making a mega-page covering them and would be happy to solicit advice:

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Blog:Tabs_...e_Proposal

[robkelk]

Looks good as a Guidelines page. I'm not sure we need a full-blown policy here, especially considering our "How we do bans" page is just a guideline.

[Bob Schroeck]

I've just granted automoderated and autopatrolled membership to "Nao", who's been a member of the wiki for five years (although not a prolific one).

[GethN7]

Looks good as a Guidelines page. I'm not sure we need a full-blown policy here, especially considering our "How we do bans" page is just a guideline.

Duly noted.

I'm also cleaning up my Sidebarmenu template to take advantage of best use with TabberNeue and redid the background to look less ugly (white now instead of drab gray, would welcome suggestions for other colors if you think one would be better, white works fine thus far though).

Belaying major changing to pages though, but I did an experiment on my sandbox page to see how well combining TabberNeue and the sidebarmenu template work:

https://allthetropes.org/w/index.php?tit...N7/sandbox

I adapted the sidebar menu currently on the below category for my test of combining TabberNeue and the Sidebarmenu template:

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Category:Anime

I was wondering if people could take a look at my sandbox on desktop and mobile and tell me how it looks. I'd like to condense the massive lists with Tabber Neue on the sidebar menus to keep pages neater and better optimize them so they don't have as much conspicuous empty space.

[robkelk]

This extension looks interesting...

Should we activate it?

[GethN7]

This extension looks interesting...

Should we activate it?

Bit redundant considering Moderation stops spammers cold.

[Bob Schroeck]

I actually use a StopForumSpam plug-in written for MyBB for the forums. What it does that Moderation doesn't is pre-emptive blocking of IPs known to be used by spammers, so they shouldn't even be able to create accounts. I'm definitely in favor of it.

[GethN7]

I actually use a StopForumSpam plug-in written for MyBB for the forums.  What it does that Moderation doesn't is pre-emptive blocking of IPs known to be used by spammers, so they shouldn't even be able to create accounts.  I'm definitely in favor of it.

Then with that in mind, sounds good.

[GethN7]

After looking over the Sidebar Menu template, I'd like to minimize usage of it except to the pages where nothing else looks aesthetically pleasing and is appropriate to the page layout.

Category pages that double as main pages for tropes with sidebar menus look really clunky and I believe higher use of TabberNeue would be preferred unless it would create so many tabs it would lead to the pitfalls of having to scroll horizontally and vertically on mobile, pursuant to Rob's earlier admonition to me.

I changed this page to demonstrate what I mean:

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Category:Espionage_Tropes

Before:

https://allthetropes.org/w/index.php?tit...id=1435997

After:

https://allthetropes.org/w/index.php?tit...ion-d6abaa

I think the after version looks a lot better, would like to know if I should continue to fix the rest of the categories in a similar manner to look nicer.

[robkelk]

After looking over the Sidebar Menu template, I'd like to minimize usage of it except to the pages where nothing else looks aesthetically pleasing and is appropriate to the page layout.

Category pages that double as main pages for tropes with sidebar menus look really clunky and I believe higher use of TabberNeue would be preferred unless it would create so many tabs it would lead to the pitfalls of having to scroll horizontally and vertically on mobile, pursuant to Rob's earlier admonition to me.

I changed this page to demonstrate what I mean:

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Category:Espionage_Tropes

Before:

https://allthetropes.org/w/index.php?tit...id=1435997

After:

https://allthetropes.org/w/index.php?tit...ion-d6abaa

I think the after version looks a lot better, would like to know if I should continue to fix the rest of the categories in a similar manner to look nicer.

Looks good to me. Might I suggest "Category:Media by decade" and its immediate subcategories for the next set? All of the "See also" lists would be identical.

[robkelk]

I actually use a StopForumSpam plug-in written for MyBB for the forums.  What it does that Moderation doesn't is pre-emptive blocking of IPs known to be used by spammers, so they shouldn't even be able to create accounts.  I'm definitely in favor of it.

Then with that in mind, sounds good.

That's three in favour, then. Activating it now... EDIT: looks like somebody beat me to it.

[Bob Schroeck]

Regarding sidemenu, yes, many of the places it's used come out ugly. And what makes it worse is that it doesn't stack -- two sidemenus in a row become two boxes side-by-side. Anything's better than that.

[robkelk]

I just made a slight modification to infobox book. We can now list two authors of a single work.

[Black Aeronaut]

Anyone know if we can use this for Get It Off Me?  Because it's a damn-near perfect example of this trope in action.  (Especially that LOOK Megatron gives Starscream here -- that picture perfect "Are you an idiot?" look.)

If it's only the portion sufficient to display the trope, under fair use, that would pass muster.

Well, looks like someone else will have to do it.  I don't have permission to upload any files, and I don't feel that I'm qualified for that level yet as I'm sure I'm still gonna make some embarrassing mistakes along the way.