All The Tropes Wiki Project, Part XXII

[Bob Schroeck]

Interesting.

On a related note, I'm still seeing SPAN markup at the bottom of info boxes like that one. Is that just me?

[GethN7]

Interesting.

On a related note, I'm still seeing SPAN markup at the bottom of info boxes like that one.  Is that just me?

That was because Rob reverted the latest version of the Module markup for infoboxes back to the old version because he hated the left-alignment it did to images in the new version. The new version fixed the span markup.

Also the new version has an easy fix. the reason it left-aligned images was because the lines for the CSS in the module (Module:Infobox, to be exact, in the latest version used by Wikipedia that I had imported) that govern image placement were given left alignment. Simply changing them to "center" would fix the issue and eliminate the span error artifacts.

[robkelk]

Interesting.

On a related note, I'm still seeing SPAN markup at the bottom of info boxes like that one.  Is that just me?

That was because Rob reverted the latest version of the Module markup for infoboxes back to the old version because he hated the left-alignment it did to images in the new version. The new version fixed the span markup.

Applying a so-called "fix" that breaks something else isn't useful.

Also the new version has an easy fix. the reason it left-aligned images was because the lines for the CSS in the module (Module:Infobox, to be exact, in the latest version used by Wikipedia that I had imported) that govern image placement were given left alignment. Simply changing them to "center" would fix the issue and eliminate the span error artifacts.

We've been over this already. I gave you weeks to implement that between reporting the issue and doing the rollback. Since you didn't, I assumed you couldn't.

EDIT: And I didn't see any documentation telling me how to make the fix, either.

[robkelk]

Let's treat this the way we should have treated it all along: as a software upgrade project.

Issue #1: Undesired text is appearing in infoboxes.

Issue #2: The patch applied to resolve Issue #1 caused images and headers in infoboxes to change alignment from centered to left-aligned.

Question #1: Can Issue #2 be resolved by re-applying the patch to resolve Issue #1 and then modifying that patch?

Question #2: If the answer to Question #1 is "yes", does the person who applies the patch to resolve Issue #1 know what needs to be done to resolve Issue #2?

Question #3: If the answer to Question #2 is "yes", what is the timetable for resolving Issue #2?

[GethN7]

Interesting.

On a related note, I'm still seeing SPAN markup at the bottom of info boxes like that one.  Is that just me?

That was because Rob reverted the latest version of the Module markup for infoboxes back to the old version because he hated the left-alignment it did to images in the new version. The new version fixed the span markup.

Applying a so-called "fix" that breaks something else isn't useful.

Also the new version has an easy fix. the reason it left-aligned images was because the lines for the CSS in the module (Module:Infobox, to be exact, in the latest version used by Wikipedia that I had imported) that govern image placement were given left alignment. Simply changing them to "center" would fix the issue and eliminate the span error artifacts.

We've been over this already. I gave you weeks to implement that between reporting the issue and doing the rollback. Since you didn't, I assumed you couldn't.

EDIT: And I didn't see any documentation telling me how to make the fix, either.

I found the problem child, Rob, this is the origin of all the buggy text on our current infoboxes

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Template:Navbar-header

Wikipedia has a new version, I recommend we download an updated version of this (with all associated pages) to replace our current one, ours is missing some key styling that results in the buggy text. And no, it will not left-align everything like you so despised, I checked to be sure by examining the template and module code.

[robkelk]

Again,

Let's treat this the way we should have treated it all along: as a software upgrade project.

Timetable, and rollback plan if it fails, please.

EDIT: I'm not asking for anything unusual here - this is the standard process for software changes in big organizations, and I review and approve/reject dozens of this sort of request every working day.

[Bob Schroeck]

No, it's perfectly reasonable. We do it every three weeks here at work. If it were me, I'd keep a copy of the original template offline, and if things got worse just drop it back in.

[GethN7]

No, it's perfectly reasonable.  We do it every three weeks here at work.  If it were me, I'd keep a copy of the original template offline, and if things got worse just drop it back in.

Concur, fair enough.

[robkelk]

Where is our new-users' FAQ? I have an entry for it:

== My edits are being rejected because of spelling mistakes! What can I do? ==
Proofreading your work before submitting it will help.
* If you prefer UK spelling, please look up your words in the [https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/ Cambridge Dictionary].<ref>The Cambridge Dictionary is available online at no charge, which is why ATT recommends it instead of the Oxford English Dictionary.</ref>
* If you prefer US spelling, please look up your words in the [https://www.merriam-webster.com/ Merriam-Webster Dictionary].
Either way, use the entries in your dictionary of choice to correct your own work before saving your changes, replacing misspelled words (and words that didn't mean what you thought they meant) with the correct words.

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/All_The_Tr...An_Example

This is a good idea Rob. In fact, I have another thing we should add, namely a list of links to good (and preferably FOSS, since it is free and usually cross-platform) spell checkers (like Grammarly), word processors (like (LibreOffice) and other tools that would be useful for proofreading and polishing up potential edits before they are submitted to ATT.

I found this page to take the dictionary list while we're working on the "Free Tools" page.

What free tools do we want to list, in addition to what's listed above?

[GethN7]

Where is our new-users' FAQ? I have an entry for it:

== My edits are being rejected because of spelling mistakes! What can I do? ==
Proofreading your work before submitting it will help.
* If you prefer UK spelling, please look up your words in the [https://dictionary.cambridge.org/us/ Cambridge Dictionary].<ref>The Cambridge Dictionary is available online at no charge, which is why ATT recommends it instead of the Oxford English Dictionary.</ref>
* If you prefer US spelling, please look up your words in the [https://www.merriam-webster.com/ Merriam-Webster Dictionary].
Either way, use the entries in your dictionary of choice to correct your own work before saving your changes, replacing misspelled words (and words that didn't mean what you thought they meant) with the correct words.

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/All_The_Tr...An_Example

This is a good idea Rob. In fact, I have another thing we should add, namely a list of links to good (and preferably FOSS, since it is free and usually cross-platform) spell checkers (like Grammarly), word processors (like (LibreOffice) and other tools that would be useful for proofreading and polishing up potential edits before they are submitted to ATT.

I found this page to take the dictionary list while we're working on the "Free Tools" page.

What free tools do we want to list, in addition to what's listed above?

Added some here:

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/All_The_Tr...r#Spelling

Sourced the online grammar checkers from here (thanks Bob):

https://allthetropes.org/w/index.php?tit...xvrfnlwgyx

The word-processors are all ones I've used I can recommend based on platform.

Decided to not make an exhaustive list, just listing the most common tools that are useful for most people.


Also made an offline XML dump of the problem child Navbar template, can simply rollback things if the fix does not work, let me know when I can try the fix and I'll rollback things is something else breaks.

[robkelk]

A bit of amusement: As of this posting, we are two-dozen disambig pages away from having pages for 1% of all possible TLAs on the wiki.

Not that I'm suggesting going out of our way to make pages for all the TLAs. Do we really need pages for "the", "you", "him", "big", and so on just for the sake of having pages? (If there's more than one work, creator, or combination thereof that uses the same TLA, that's a different matter.)

[LulzKiller]

A bit of amusement: As of this posting, we are two-dozen disambig pages away from having pages for 1% of all possible TLAs on the wiki.

Not that I'm suggesting going out of our way to make pages for all the TLAs. Do we really need pages for "the", "you", "him", "big", and so on just for the sake of having pages? (If there's more than one work, creator, or combination thereof that uses the same TLA, that's a different matter.)

Is there an easy way to quantify the non-created ones that are most wanted?

[robkelk]

A bit of amusement: As of this posting, we are two-dozen disambig pages away from having pages for 1% of all possible TLAs on the wiki.

Not that I'm suggesting going out of our way to make pages for all the TLAs. Do we really need pages for "the", "you", "him", "big", and so on just for the sake of having pages? (If there's more than one work, creator, or combination thereof that uses the same TLA, that's a different matter.)

Is there an easy way to quantify the non-created ones that are most wanted?

Not really, as far as I know. I just create them when I discover there's a need.

EDIT: And just after I hit save, I remembered Category:Pages Needing Disambiguation.

[LulzKiller]

Had to reject some moderation logs because they CamelCasedTheTropes

[Bob Schroeck]

Yeah, that's often a good sign they're drive-bys dropping in stuff cut-n-pasted from TVT.

[robkelk]

Did we ever figure out why navboxes are not autocollapsing?

I just added "state = {{{state|autocollapse}}}" to a few, and it doesn't appear to be making any difference.

EDIT: I just noticed that it is adding a "Collapse" link to the navboxes... but it isn't autocollapsing them when there's more than one on a page (for example, our page for The English Patient)

[robkelk]

I have no idea how to update the "Trope" template - all I saw when I tried is an "invoke" to something that I don't know where to find.

(Documentation is useful, people. It gets me off your back and lets somebody who isn't you do this kind of grunt work.)

Whoever knows how, please update the "Create New" menu in the Trope template as listed below:

• Please replace "Fanfiction" with "Fan Works"
  
• Please replace "Live Action TV" with "Live-Action TV" (note the dash)
  
• Please replace "Visual Novels" with "Visual Novel"
  
• Please replace "Webcomics" with "Web Comics"
  
• Please add "Advertising"
  
• Please add "Newspaper Comics"
  
• Please add "Professional Wrestling"
  
• Please add "Puppet Shows"
  
• Please add "Web Original"
  
• Please delete "Television"
  
• Please change the fill-in-the-blank option at the end of the list so that it loads a Trope template instead of a Work template.
  

[LulzKiller]

I have no idea how to update the "Trope" template - all I saw when I tried is an "invoke" to something that I don't know where to find.

(Documentation is useful, people. It gets me off your back and lets somebody who isn't you do this kind of grunt work.)

Whoever knows how, please update the "Create New" menu in the Trope template as listed below:

• Please replace "Fanfiction" with "Fan Works"
  
• Please replace "Live Action TV" with "Live-Action TV" (note the dash)
  
• Please replace "Visual Novels" with "Visual Novel"
  
• Please replace "Webcomics" with "Web Comics"
  
• Please add "Advertising"
  
• Please add "Newspaper Comics"
  
• Please add "Professional Wrestling"
  
• Please add "Puppet Shows"
  
• Please add "Web Original"
  
• Please delete "Television"
  
• Please change the fill-in-the-blank option at the end of the list so that it loads a Trope template instead of a Work template.
  

We use the https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto extension in order to run Lua, this invokes Module code, which means we edit Module:Subpages 6.

Done all but the last because I can't find it.

[LulzKiller]

Somewhere it loads MediaWiki:GenericSubpage which is a template for a generic work subpage, that might be a starter.

[Bob Schroeck]

We use the https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto extension in order to run Lua, this invokes Module code, which means we edit Module:Subpages 6.

Oh, that's good to know. I once went looking, myself, only to get utterly lost.

[robkelk]

I have no idea how to update the "Trope" template - all I saw when I tried is an "invoke" to something that I don't know where to find.

(Documentation is useful, people. It gets me off your back and lets somebody who isn't you do this kind of grunt work.)

Whoever knows how, please update the "Create New" menu in the Trope template as listed below:

• Please replace "Fanfiction" with "Fan Works"
  
• Please replace "Live Action TV" with "Live-Action TV" (note the dash)
  
• Please replace "Visual Novels" with "Visual Novel"
  
• Please replace "Webcomics" with "Web Comics"
  
• Please add "Advertising"
  
• Please add "Newspaper Comics"
  
• Please add "Professional Wrestling"
  
• Please add "Puppet Shows"
  
• Please add "Web Original"
  
• Please delete "Television"
  
• Please change the fill-in-the-blank option at the end of the list so that it loads a Trope template instead of a Work template.
  

We use the https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Scribunto extension in order to run Lua, this invokes Module code, which means we edit Module:Subpages 6.

Done all but the last because I can't find it.

Thanks, both for the work and for telling us how to do it ourselves.

[LulzKiller]

SO to Bees for making the work pages for all Batman Nolan trilogy films, all we need now is to port the subpages.

[Bob Schroeck]

I suppose it was our bad experience with Cwf1997, who was the last user to sweep in and start creating pages like that wholesale, that's responsible but I find myself inexplicably nervous about BeesFan12. I haven't found any issues with their edits, copyright or other, and I'm starting to relax, but I'll admit I'm still waiting for the other shoe to drop.

[robkelk]

Bread and Circuses has a noreallife tag, giving the reason "By definition controversial and depressing."

Is this something that we inherited from TV Tropes and should jettison, or do we need to get rid of everything listed in Category:Depressing Tropes? We can't have it both ways -- either we list depressing things or we don't.

First question: Do we already have a policy regarding this?

Second question: If we don't, do we want to ask the Tropers whether they want one?

[LulzKiller]

Bread and Circuses has a noreallife tag, giving the reason "By definition controversial and depressing."

Is this something that we inherited from TV Tropes and should jettison, or do we need to get rid of everything listed in Categoryepressing Tropes? We can't have it both ways -- either we list depressing things or we don't.

First question: Do we already have a policy regarding this?

Second question: If we don't, do we want to ask the Tropers whether they want one?

I think the easier solution is to just keep NRL for the controversial aspect due to the fact that it would descend into political shitflinging/conspiratorial nonsense (they're trying to keep you pacified bruh open ur 3rd eye). I agree that something being depressing isn't a reason to avoid troping, we'd have to remove Tear Jerker if we did.