All The Tropes Wiki Project, Part XXXI

[MilkmanConspiracy]

There’s a user who is seeming asking for their unused alt account to be deleted. Not sure what to make of it.

[robkelk]

There's nothing we can do about alternate accounts; our hosting service controls that part of the wiki farm.

I'll check which group can help (it might be the Stewards, it might be somebody under them) and get back to the user tomorrow.

[robkelk]

The link issues that have been affecting the KanriKyara wiki for months have been spotted on ATT.

[robkelk]

There's nothing we can do about alternate accounts; our hosting service controls that part of the wiki farm.

I'll check which group can help (it might be the Stewards, it might be somebody under them) and get back to the user tomorrow.

It's a group who are under the Stewards, but the procedure to contact that group involves going through the Stewards anyway. I've let the user know that there isn't a problem with them having two accounts as long as they don't abuse them.

[MilkmanConspiracy]

The link issues that have been affecting the KanriKyara wiki for months have been spotted on ATT.

I actually noticed this when it comes to links from UserPages no longer showing up on new links, however I had assumed this was intentional behavior. If that wasn’t intentional, then it’s been going on for a while. Not sure if that helps.

[robkelk]

Could somebody who's familiar with how the interwiki table works on Miraheze reply to this post, please?

[Bob Schroeck]

So... bets that new user Mymobilityscooters8494 will turn out to be a dedicated troper quickly earning membership in the automoderated group for the sheer volume of their high-quality edits and unceasing devotion to the wiki?

No?

I didn't think so...

[GethN7]

Could somebody who's familiar with how the interwiki table works on Miraheze reply to this post, please?

Those changes can be easily implemented via this page, which has a relatively straightforward layout for doing so:

https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Special:Interwiki

I'd prefer consensus before we do anything, but I don't object to any of the proposed changes.

[Labster]

I went ahead and replied. Doing those updates to the interwiki map would be fine with me.

Honestly it looks like the interwiki table hasn't been changed since Orain. Naturally this is a consequence of Miraheze restricting access to Special:Interwiki for years out of some security risk (and then giving you full access to Common.js). Some of them we are replacing the correct global entries with incorrect global ones, like for `oeis` and `hammondwiki`, and there are some other ones like `test` and `zzz wiki` that don't resolve. We should go through all of these and see what we actually need.

[Bob Schroeck]

Well. I am so not surprised that HLIAA14YOG tried to pass off CSA: Confederate States of America as an over-the-top parody. It seems very consistent with his political stances as seen in other postings. <sigh> He's getting to be almost as bad as that Hitler apologist we bumrushed out the door a few years back.

[robkelk]

Well. I am so not surprised that HLIAA14YOG tried to pass off CSA: Confederate States of America as an over-the-top parody. It seems very consistent with his political stances as seen in other postings. <sigh> He's getting to be almost as bad as that Hitler apologist we bumrushed out the door a few years back.

We did have this conversation earlier this month:

Looking at this troper's history, I see that this is bigger than I thought at first.

I need unequivocal statements from the admins: Did HLIAA14YOG violate our rules?

We warned him in this post that "When your tempban expires, you will remain On Notice. Any violation of any rule, policy, or guideline will be grounds for a permanent ban from editing here."

So this isn't just a matter of rejecting an edit because of how it's worded. This is a matter of perma-banning a user who (as I've pointed out in the past) brings to ATT a viewpoint that is not shared by most of the mods. I need to know that he did or did not do something to deserve a ban before I do anything about these edits.

That said, I think that he did break the rules. This is what I was going to say to him before I thought to double-check his history:

You said that the magazine has retracted their statement; we must assume that this was because they could not support their statement in court. Since it has been retracted, we have only your word that this was ever published at all.

Also, even if you ''do'' have evidence that this was said, we cannot find any evidence that the action was ever actually performed the way that you described it.

Please note that "Adding incorrect text and presenting it as fact" is listed as grounds for a warning on the first occurrence and a tempban on a repeated occurrence.
Please note that "Making potentially libellous statements on an opinion page" is listed as grounds for a tempban without warning on the first occurrence.

I wasn't thinking of the edits on that level. Upon reconsidering in that context, I fully support basically telling him we've had it with his shit and don't let the door hit him on the way out.

That said, I agree that they may have flown too close to the sun on this. They were warned about such behavior in the past.

"Please note that "Making potentially libellous statements on an opinion page" is listed as grounds for a tempban without warning on the first occurrence."

I’d say it’s more serious than that, since it’s the primary page, not an opinion page.

Kinda torn to be honest. On one hand, he does cite something that was written down and it is a factual statement that can be verified. On the other hand, he doesn't stop at the facts, and adds some soapboxing to the end.

Personally, I'm on the fence, but won't oppose the result of everyone else deciding what to do one way or the other.

That said, I agree that they may have flown too close to the sun on this. They were warned about such behavior in the past.

"Please note that "Making potentially libellous statements on an opinion page" is listed as grounds for a tempban without warning on the first occurrence."

I’d say it’s more serious than that, since it’s the primary page, not an opinion page.

Kinda torn to be honest. On one hand, he does cite something that was written down and it is a factual statement that can be verified. On the other hand, he doesn't stop at the facts, and adds some soapboxing to the end.

Personally, I'm on the fence, but won't oppose the result of everyone else deciding what to do one way or the other.

I’m kind of in the same boat, if my wording didn’t make it clear. I do think they are trying to do better, and it’s human nature to trip up and backslide while trying to change habits, get heated at seeing certain news, etc. Still, the terms presented to them were cut and dry, so it’s difficult to just ignore it.

We made the decision; we simply failed to implement it.

The wiki's in the middle of the daily "we're too busy backing up data to actually serve pages" period, so he gets another hour at least. I'll wait for four hours (until noon ET); that gives folks a last chance to change their votes if they want.

[Bob Schroeck]

No. Thank him but tell him his services are no longer required.

(I'm tempted to insist that we make it sound like a DOGE firing, just because, but that would probably be excessively cruel.)

[robkelk]

And I forgot that it's wiki-maintenance day.

Well, we get another four or five hours to go over the wording of the message. Here's what I wold have posted if the wiki was still up:

Subject: You have used your last chance. Your account is now blocked.

Text:

Your proposed edits to [[Cate Blanchett]] and [[Sandra Bullock]] that relied on a retracted statement from a single source (and thus has to be considered to be suspect at best and libel at worst) were bad enough that they were summarily rejected for the safety of the wiki. All The Tropes has no desire to be sued for libel.

Your proposed edit to [[Oppressive States of America]] that described the ''[[CSA: Confederate States of America]]'' example started with facts, but you continued into unfounded speculation about the movie being a parody when simply watching the credits would have shown you that it was true to historical attitudes. Your edit was approved with an ''immediate'' edit that make clear that the movie is not a parody.

[[Topic:Ydfxvqi4w13831ks|This is not the first time you have presented your opinion as if it was fact. Nor is it the first time you have seen fit to use this wiki as a venue to insult people who you have not met. Nor is it the first time that you have been tempbanned for such behaviour.]]

But it is the last time.

You have demonstrated that you are either unable or unwilling to follow the rules that have been pointed out to you repeatedly (in any but your simplest and most mechanical edits).

You have demonstrated that you are not willing to respect people who you do not agree with – ''which is described at [[All The Tropes:There is No One True Way]] as being a core rule of this wiki'' – even after being tempbanned for breaking this rule in the past.

You have demonstrated that you are either unable or unwilling to learn from your own mistakes.

[https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Topic:Ydfx...8s163kvh1e GethN7 previously told you that "you are on your last chance".] [https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Topic:Ydfx...utoja0t2y2 You acknowledged that.] He tossed you a lifeline, which you have instead chosen to use to hang yourself.


'''As per discussion and vote of the administrators, ''your account is now banned''.'''


Since you have demonstrated that you will not follow the rules here, I can only suggest that you try troping at another troping site such as [https://tvtropes.org/ TVTropes] or [https://tropedia.fandom.com/wiki/Tropedia Tropedia]... because you are no longer welcome at this one.

–Robkelk, admin

{{admins}}

[Bob Schroeck]

In the meantime, miraheze as a whole appears to be down. ATT, KanriKyara and meta all are returning nothing or "something went wrong" pages, and downforeveryoneorjustme.com reports all three as down.

EDIT: And at the same time I posted this, Rob posted

And I forgot that it's wiki-maintenance day.

<waves hand> Me, too!

[robkelk]

In the meantime, miraheze as a whole appears to be down.  ATT, KanriKyara and meta all are returning nothing or "something went wrong" pages, and downforeveryoneorjustme.com reports all three as down.

Scheduled maintenance, scheduled to last at least another four hours.

[Bob Schroeck]

Here's what I wold have posted if the wiki was still up:

That looks fine to me. I see no need to change it.

[Bob Schroeck]

ATT is back up. Time to drop the hammer, Rob.

EDIT: Never mind, the database is still locked.

[GethN7]

I will not oppose the hammer dropping at all. I tossed out a rope, it was used as a noose. So whenever you deem appropriate Rob.

[Labster]

Wikis are unlocked now. Maintenance is complete.

[robkelk]

And the deed is done. "Horny" is now blocked indefinitely.

[MilkmanConspiracy]

I will not oppose the hammer dropping at all. I tossed out a rope, it was used as a noose. So whenever you deem appropriate Rob.

I’m late to respond, but I feel similarly. The offer was clear, and while I wouldn’t want someone banned over a fluke, an exhibited trend of violations of the agreement can’t be abided.

[MilkmanConspiracy]

A few oddball questions:

• Is there a way to ping active users for feedback the same was as {{Admins}}? Or should they be pinged individually with flowmention? (Thinking about feedback on image replacements. I would want to limit the rate of course)
  
• If a work has subpages in existence, but the main page is a redirect to a franchise page, is it better to create a page at the redirect, and then request a move if the existing title is wrong, or is it better to create the page at the correct address, then request a move for the existing pages?
  

[Bob Schroeck]

There's never been an easy way to send an all-call to editors that I know of. I used to keep a text file of FlowMention markups for every active editor to paste into messages where I wanted community feedback, but after someone complained about being bothered by things he wasn't interested in I stopped using it (much).

If the existing title is wrong, the subpages should be moved to be under the correct title, creating the work page if necessary. If the title is right but the page is a redirect, create the work page.

[MilkmanConspiracy]

There's never been an easy way to send an all-call to editors that I know of.  I used to keep a text file of FlowMention markups for every active editor to paste into messages where I wanted community feedback, but after someone complained about being bothered by things he wasn't interested in I stopped using it (much).

If the existing title is wrong, the subpages should be moved to be under the correct title, creating the work page if necessary.  If the title is right but the page is a redirect, create the work page.

That makes sense - Thank you for your help!

[Bob Schroeck]

You're welcome!