All The Tropes Wiki Project, Part III

[Bob Schroeck]

Oh well, site is down now

What's up this time?
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Labster]

What's up this time?

Admin staff went to Wikimania, putting off the the bug that they weren't getting @orain.org emailSomething (maybe my bot? but it was 6 hours after it was off) caused us to get shut off from RamNode for excessive CPU usePeople were still out of town, so it took a couple of hours and some searches to find working contact info.RamNode didn't turn us back on right away because we hadn't paid the billsThe bills had arrived a while back, sent to a non-functional @orain.org email account.
Anyway, they've been talking about load-balancing anyway.  Everything is still on prod4, and prod5 isn't being used at all right now.
So far as the page creation bug, I can't reproduce it in either Firefox or Safari, logged-in or logged-out.  If it persists, provide me with the HTML of the template and whatever you're getting from Common.js.
One that works out, I have a new version of the {{work}} template that automatically generates submenus.
-- ∇×V

[Bob Schroeck]

Cool.

Oh, hey, I went to use the DISPLAYTITLE template last night and it looked like it was gone; is that intentional?
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Labster]

{{DISPLAYTITLE}} is not a template.  See Help:Magic words
I'm getting ready to deploy a new {{trope}}/{{work}} template that makes submenus appear, so that if you have a pages like Star Trek: The Next Generation/Recap/S3/E1 The Best of Both Worlds, you get a menu like:
 ( Recap )|  S1 »  ||  S2 »  || _S3 »_ | ( E1 The Best of Both Worlds         )|  S4 »  | | E2 The one where they go to France ||  ...   |Now, the main problem is that we don't have pages named exactly like that.  I'm trying to decide if I want to rename them, or come up with some kind of hack to make it work with the spaced version in Recap.
Took a while to develop too, took some PHP code I found, translated it to Perl so I could think, and then retranslated it to Lua.  After discovering it took 10 times longer to run, I kept messing around with minor optimizations -- until I realized that the slowdown was from using the unicode string library instead of byte-strings.  Since the only string ops work on ASCII characters and passthrough the rest, I got rid of mw.ustring to get comparable speed to the earlier template.  The difference here was only .10s to .01s, but you know, every page it adds up.
In other news, it looks like we might be moving to a new hosting company next week to improve stability.  RamNode is dirt cheap but you get what you pay for.
-- ∇×V

[Bob Schroeck]

Ah, that's the help page I was looking for while trying to make the thing work. Thanks.

I like the look of the new menuing system. I can't advise you on the implementation, as I know no Lua and really have no idea what it takes to code for MediaWiki.

And yay for more stability. By "we" do you mean Orain as a whole, or just ATT?
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

The forums are gone... outright vanished; links to the various threads end up in "not found" errors.  And most of the left-edge menu options are gone as well.
And there's only one entry in yesterday's history.
Edit:  Correction:  Recent Changes only shows one entry for 8/22.  My user contributions page shows everything I did. 
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

Even worse -- searching for media at least returns the following:

Database error

A database query error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software.

Function: SearchMySQL:earchInternal
Error: 144 Table './allthetropeswiki/searchindex' is marked as crashed and last (automatic?) repair failed (10.131.243.49)

Edit:  No licensing options beyond "none selected" are available on the file upload page.  Something's majorly buggered up here.
Edit 2:  Preferences are missing gadgets and tools and other non-basic stuff.  Recent Changes no longer has the AJAX autoupdate.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[robkelk]

I noticed there was some maintenance going on last night.

I suspect the maintenance isn't yet complete, since we still have the Wanted Pages list from 9:03 am Friday...

EDIT: On a different note, which of these subpage names is preferred: Fanfic Recs, Fan fic Recs, Fan Fic Recs, Fanfic Recommendations, Fan fic Recommendations, or Fan Fic Recommendations? Before somebody runs a bot to fix that, the relevant category pages need to be cleaned up.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[robkelk]

Wiki's gone bye-bye...

(And I was just about to update "There Was a Door/Film - Live-Action" to change "The [[Kentucky Fried Movie]" to "[[The Kentucky Fried Movie]"... )
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

It's sort of back. Features are there again, but attempts to move pages get the Database error still, and edits get me a no-style version page with no changes made.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[robkelk]

@robkelk: thanks for the new category, makes cleanup a lot easier

Second as for the Wikipedia thing, I'm astounded at the conclusions they are reaching. They are apparantly at the consensus TVT links/citations should not be allowed at all, but the reasons are for WP policy, not legality, even though both apply (regardless, their focus only seems to be on the first item)

Further, maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt anyone is actually going over the pages where the links/citations are used and why, merely seeing it's a wiki link and falling back on policy reasons why it shouldn't exist at all. I also doubt anyone is actually checking to see if TV Tropes really is in violation of copyright/licensing, as that already seems to be ignored althougth it would seem to me to be quite relevant to the topic at hand......

Basically, I'm throwing my hands up in air here at this point on that.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/08/24 ... _backfire/]It looks like Wikipedia doesn't care about copyright. Now that I know this, I'm going to hold off on using them as a source until the matter is settled - who knows how much of the well has been poisoned?
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[GethN7]

@robkelk: thanks for the new category, makes cleanup a lot easier

Second as for the Wikipedia thing, I'm astounded at the conclusions they are reaching. They are apparantly at the consensus TVT links/citations should not be allowed at all, but the reasons are for WP policy, not legality, even though both apply (regardless, their focus only seems to be on the first item)

Further, maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt anyone is actually going over the pages where the links/citations are used and why, merely seeing it's a wiki link and falling back on policy reasons why it shouldn't exist at all. I also doubt anyone is actually checking to see if TV Tropes really is in violation of copyright/licensing, as that already seems to be ignored althougth it would seem to me to be quite relevant to the topic at hand......

Basically, I'm throwing my hands up in air here at this point on that.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/08/24 ... _backfire/ Now that I know this, I'm going to hold off on using them as a source until the matter is settled - who knows how much of the well has been poisoned?

 

Oh dear, that does look like a problem, not sure if I want to keep using them myself knowing this.

However, good news. Our stability is returning to ATT, and our forums/talk pages had their contents restored, the other problems, if any, will be cleared up soon.

[Bob Schroeck]

robkelk wrote:

---

EDIT: On a different note, which of these subpage names is preferred: Fanfic Recs, Fan fic Recs, Fan Fic Recs, Fanfic Recommendations, Fan fic Recommendations, or Fan Fic Recommendations? Before somebody runs a bot to fix that, the relevant category pages need to be cleaned up.

Oops, forgot to reply to this question.  I'm in favor of "Fanfic Recommendations", myself.  We should probably put this question to the wiki in a forum post, though.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

GethN7 wrote:

---

However, good news. Our stability is returning to ATT, and our forums/talk pages had their contents restored, the other problems, if any, will be cleared up soon.

Now that's good news.  As for Wikipedia, very troubling, and the folks at the convention making light of the issue just makes them look like jerks.  Maybe we ought to start up a collection for the photographer to pay for his legal costs.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[GethN7]

Our database has been completely moved to a dedicated server now, all bugs have been ironed out now (I know, I helped John bug test it)

More info here:

http://allthetropes.orain.org/wiki/For ... Orain_1399

[robkelk]

EDIT: On a different note, which of these subpage names is preferred: Fanfic Recs, Fan fic Recs, Fan Fic Recs, Fanfic Recommendations, Fan fic Recommendations, or Fan Fic Recommendations? Before somebody runs a bot to fix that, the relevant category pages need to be cleaned up.

Oops, forgot to reply to this question. I'm in favor of "Fanfic Recommendations", myself. We should probably put this question to the wiki in a forum post, though.

Yeah.

While we're at it: "Anime and Manga", "Anime & Manga", "Anime/Manga", or separate "Anime" and "Manga" pages? (I really don't like the last one.)
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

I prefer fully-spelling "and" to an ampersand. "Anime and Manga" is my choice.

In other news: any and all attempts to move pages fail with a 500 error.
Edit:  Oh, and I created a thread on the Discussion page for a Trope Workship page, and two copies of the thread appeared.  I could delete one and leave the other untouched, but I thought it more than a little odd.
Edit 2:  Page moves sometimes succeed despite the 500 error -- generally ones where I'm inserting colons into the page names.  However, I cannot rename "Good Looking Privates" to "Good-Looking Privates" no matter what I do.   
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[GethN7]

I prefer fully-spelling "and" to an ampersand. "Anime and Manga" is my choice.

In other news: any and all attempts to move pages fail with a 500 error.

Edit:  Oh, and I created a thread on the Discussion page for a Trope Workship page, and two copies of the thread appeared.  I could delete one and leave the other untouched, but I thought it more than a little odd.

Edit 2:  Page moves sometimes succeed despite the 500 error -- generally ones where I'm inserting colons into the page names.  However, I cannot rename "Good Looking Privates" to "Good-Looking Privates" no matter what I do.
   

 

Figured it out. The searchindex was corrupted and putting the server CPU into a cycle feedback loop that was forcing all other operations to crap out at random.

Should be getting fixed as I type this.

[Bob Schroeck]

Cool. Thanks, Geth.

I wish I knew enough to do something more than just send up a flag when stuff like this happens.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[GethN7]

This was a server side issue, not much anyone but Orain Staff could do about it.

Regardless, pointing these things out ASAP is incredibly helpful, thanks for your continued vigilance, Bob, it is appreciated.

[Bob Schroeck]

You're welcome!

Things are improving slowly -- but moves and deletes still go to a 500 page, even though most moves and all deletes work. So far, moves that involve adding just a dash to a name (such as my earlier example, Good Looking Privates) always fails completely. Why? I have no clue.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

Today's Infuriating Annoyance:
All searches return "504 Gateway Time-out".
Edit:  Is there any chance we can get the "back to main page" link in the various header templates to use a DISPLAYTITLE if one exists?  See the http://allthetropes.orain.org/wiki/BrokeNCYDE/YMMV]YMMV page for brokeNCYDE for an example of what I mean.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[robkelk]

Massive digression:

GethN7, I noticed you created an account on my new wiki (which, BTW, I'll be officially announcing on Monday). Was that because of an interest in the subject matter, because I asked for the wiki to be created, because it's on Orain, some combination of the three, or some other reason? (And do you mind if I draft you as an administrator/bureaucrat, just in case something happens to me?)
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[GethN7]

@Rob - Sure, go ahead and make me whatever, just in case you want someone to mind the store in case you go MIA for some reason. Also, I mostly visited out of curiosity, the subject matter looks interesting.

FYI, if you want, I can doll up your new wiki with stuff like HotCat and other nice features in case you need them.

[robkelk]

@Rob - Sure, go ahead and make me whatever, just in case you want someone to mind the store in case you go MIA for some reason. Also, I mostly visited out of curiosity, the subject matter looks interesting.

FYI, if you want, I can doll up your new wiki with stuff like HotCat and other nice features in case you need them.

Thanks. Let's take this to our talk pages there, and leave this thread for ATT.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012