All The Tropes Wiki Project, Part VII

[GethN7]

You all may find this very amusing:

http://www.reddit.com/r/KotakuInAction ... _a_school/

We get a positive mention as well.

[Bob Schroeck]

Heh.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[robkelk]

So we did.

Geth, since (a) you've already taken part in the thread and (b) I don't have a reddit account, you might want to reply to the post from "RobertNAdams" immediately below yours. (Short answer is "incompatible licenses", which should tell you the question.)
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[robkelk]

In an unrelated note...

I just noticed that, when we have sub-sub-pages in a hierarchy, {{BASEPAGENAME}} returns all but the lowest level of the hierarchy, while {{ROOTPAGENAME}} returns only the uppermost level of the hierarchy.

(For example, the BASEPAGENAME of "One Piece/Characters/Anime Only" is "One Piece/Characters", while the ROOTPAGENAME of that page is "One Piece".)

I don't have time at the moment to do more testing (for example, what does ROOTPAGENAME return on "One Piece/Characters"?) or edit the page templates, so if somebody else has a few minutes, feel free.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[TvT Rivals]

You mentioned some important task that's still ahead of us: Checking all the links (and mentions!) of Tv Tropes in our wiki corpus. But we plan to do that after our wiki goes live. After beta, in fact.

Sorry for the long pause, but we're pondering the launch.

[GethN7]

Lulzkiller and I were talking, and he and his buddy Cobaltcat suggested a good idea.

We need to make better use of navboxes.

We inherited our model of doing business from TV Tropes, which doesn't have navboxes nor can support them due to using a different wiki engine, but we can use them, and for certain pages they may provide more accessible navigation.

Me, I think it's a good idea, wanted to get everyone else's opinion.

[robkelk]

As I've already mentioned to Lulzkiller, I think they're a great idea and I wish I had time to implement them.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

Oh yeah, sure!
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[robkelk]

That was odd... I checked the site today and it said I had 41 alerts - all of which were for messages I'd seen weeks or months ago. Then when I made my first edit of the evening, I got the "welcome to editing" popup.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[GethN7]

I think we might need a "Pages That Do Not Need an Image" category, for reasons like this page.

http://allthetropes.org/wiki/Muhammad

As I understand it, it is considered VERY offensive to depict the Prophet Muhammad in any context, and even Wikipedia defaults to an image of an inscription describing him and little more.

However, there is a caveat to this. It only applies to pages like this or pages where we cannot depict an image for whatever reason (like the content being so X-rated there is no way to sufficiently depict it without posting outright porn)

[robkelk]

Feel free to copy http://poserdazfreebies.miraheze.org/w ... please.jpg for this - even if we didn't use compatible CC licenses, I placed that image in PD.

(We should crop it, as well - it's 250px wide because the freebie wiki's default infobox resizes images to 250px wide.)
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[GethN7]

Feel free to copy http://poserdazfreebies.miraheze.org/w ... please.jpg for this - even if we didn't use compatible CC licenses, I placed that image in PD.

(We should crop it, as well - it's 250px wide because the freebie wiki's default infobox resizes images to 250px wide.)

Thanks Rob, did that.

[robkelk]

I've done some research on this... Of the two major branches of Islam, Shi'a forbids depictions of any intelligent being, including God and the Prophet. Sunni Islam has no problem with depictions of Muhammad (and, according to Wikipedia, they're not rare in Iran.)

That said, I think we should continue with the current policy:

• There's no reason to knowingly insult somebody, even if somebody else doesn't see it as an insult.
  
• Adding an image to the article does not enhance the article.
  
• Freedom of speech includes freedom to remain silent, so there's no moral position taken if we either do or do not add an image.
  
• Least importantly, the mod team doesn't have time to deal with the complaints we'd get if we did include an image.
  

---

We're getting 503s on Miraheze again.
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[GethN7]

I've done some research on this... Of the two major branches of Islam, Shi'a forbids depictions of any intelligent being, including God and the Prophet. Sunni Islam has no problem with depictions of Muhammad (and, according to Wikipedia, they're not rare in Iran.)

That said, I think we should continue with the current policy:

• There's no reason to knowingly insult somebody, even if somebody else doesn't see it as an insult.
  
• Adding an image to the article does not enhance the article.
  
• Freedom of speech includes freedom to remain silent, so there's no moral position taken if we either do or do not add an image.
  
• Least importantly, the mod team doesn't have time to deal with the complaints we'd get if we did include an image.
  

---

We're getting 503s on Miraheze again.

First, thanks for the research, and I agree on policy.

Also, checked, Miraheze has some database issues, currently working on it.

[Bob Schroeck]

We're getting 503s on Miraheze again.

According to the Miraheze Twitter and Facebook pages, they had a catastrophic crash of the server that took down everything on Miraheze. They're in the process of moving everything to a new server right now.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Labster]

Yeah, it was another of those DB catastrophes.  We're still in read-only mode because two of our tables got corrupted -- thankfully two tables that can be regenerated from the page text which is all complete.  It looks like my last edit is there, so no data loss.  But I'm aware we need some better recovery process.  I'm arguing for replication, so please give us some money to add a second db server?
-- ∇×V

[robkelk]

Asking for money at Xmastime rarely works, alas. But remind us on Boxing Day...

---

Dropping this content here until we can create the page SCTV/Image Links :

* [http://regmedia.co.uk/2015/07/22/bob_a ... kenzie.jpg "The Great White North". G'day, eh?]
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

Well, we're back up, but the wiki is stumbling along at a snail's pace, and every few minutes stops to barf up a puddle of 503 Back-end fetch errors on the user's shoes.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[TvT Rivals]

Guys, we made an important step: After cutting up many subpages, identifying which main pages they belong to and fixing lines that didn't fit, we read in about 15k files and added more than 100k examples to our database.

We may register the domain very soon (well, we have to, if we want to launch in fall as promised).

Good luck with MW, BTW.

[Labster]

Just rebuilt the search index, so everything should be back to working 100% now.  Let me know if you have any issues.
Also I think http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File ... tation.png would be a good image for Mohammed.  It's pretty.  So far as other things, I think we should try to find "safe" images of things whenever possible.  See also the image I added to Brother-Sister Incest.  That is art, not porn, right?  But it's an old as dirt example of the trope too.
Ultimately there's going to be no version of content that makes everyone happy, so we should try to make ourselves happy.  Under Rob's explanation of sharia, I'm wondering if Spongebob Squarepants is haram or not?  So yeah, we don't have to offend others on purpose, but we should try to make our wiki the best thing that we want.
-- ∇×V

[robkelk]

...
Ultimately there's going to be no version of content that makes everyone happy, so we should try to make ourselves happy.  Under Rob's explanation of sharia, I'm wondering if Spongebob Squarepants is haram or not?  So yeah, we don't have to offend others on purpose, but we should try to make our wiki the best thing that we want.

Now that you've asked, I'm wondering that as well.

Meh. There will always be edge cases, and we'll cut ourselves on some of those edges.

---

EDIT: Just noticed that the multiple-image upload functionality is gone... (checks the freebie wiki) ...apparently across all of Miraheze. Is this a temporary thing?
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Labster]

Just a few random news items:
I switched out DynamicPageList for DynamicPageList3 (different maintainers than DPL or DPL2, natch) on ATT.  One of the results of that is that I was able to automatically generate a list for Tropes/Headscratchers using a couple of lines of template.  Also if you see anything on that list that is not a Trope, that means it has the {{trope}} template instead of {{work}}.  The full manual for this version of DPL is useful.  We have a new extension, go crazy with it.  On second thought, don't, because some of these queries can be expensive.  Keep to simpler things with only a few conditions.
Miraheze has approved a privacy policy, and has a proposed Terms of Use and Content policy.  The latter only applies to wiki admins, which means about half of us here   Anyway we want to get this done by the end of the year.  In other Miraheze news, we got a nice grant from Wright State University, about $700, so we get to have another year of wiki hosting.  Or maybe nonprofit status, we'll see.
@robkelk: Not sure what you mean about the multiple image upload thing.  Maybe open an issue in Phabricator?  Also, while we're not sure about SpongeBob, I don't think Patrick would qualify as an intelligent being.
-- ∇×V

[Bob Schroeck]

Brent, the Terms of Use link goes to Gamepedia's DPL manual.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Bob Schroeck]

Also, places like the Trope Workshop where you're using the new DPL, there are various errors, and a red "broken template" link reading "Template:Extension DPL".
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[GethN7]

Lulzkiller has applied for admin rights here;

http://allthetropes.org/wiki/Topic:Thivaicnrg6kb5w2

I for one would love to have him on the mod team ASAP, but since we try to decide things by consensus, I request anyone else file any assent or objection before giving him his mod hat.