MKR Step?

[Ace Dreamer]

As Bob suggested moving this speculation here...
*** major Magic Knight Rayearth spoiler, below ***
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The basic premise of MKR is that the maintainer of the world that the Knights have to save has made the really major error of falling in love with her High Priest; definately a case of falling in love with your own creation.
The solution of the series is to get three Japanese teenagers (female, of course), drag them into this world, train them up into magical warriors, and then make them into murderers by tricking them into killing the world maintainer.
This supposed gets her out of the problem that she can't (directly) suicide, and saves the world from destruction by her mis-placed passion, so she can presumably be replaced by someone else who is not allowed love.
Doug might get involved in this before the Knights are summoned (by the wizard?), and try and figure a way that the world maintainer can function while still feeling love. My suggestion in the other thread was that Doug persuade her to Breakpoint the reality, freeze it, then go off to some other world(s) in search of a solution.
I thought this might be fun...
And, allows the possibility of all sorts of cross-over action!
--
"It is the business of the future to be dangerous" - Hawkwind

[ariel silverstorm]

course you could always go the UF way and find an aesir to take over the job. hmm could cancel one of Dougs markers.
hey how about a whole planet full of worshipers and you cancel my mark.
or wonder at Rei Goddess of Cephiro.

[Loki Laufeyjarson]

You forgot about the most important parts when decsribing MKR: The (sort of) giant robots and the fact that everybody and everything not from earth is named after a car or something car-related. (With the exception of Rayearth and Mokona).
I would suggest putting a crossover simply into the second part (MKR II) or after the end of the series. There really is not enough room for an inserted charcter in the first part. Giving him the knowledge of the true nature of Cephiro and the pillar would IMHO be a copout.
Then again if he can't play the magical omniscient problem solver, he would have to contend with the giant fighting machines (is there a giant-robot song?) and deal with the making-enemies-into-friends-instead-of-just-killing-them part. Not anything where Doug wold have to add much to what the Magic-Kights already could accomplish without him.

[Bob Schroeck]

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(is there a giant-robot song?)

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The full-length, "I really want to copy 'Flash Gordon' by Queen" version of the theme to "The Big O", maybe?
Damn, now why does the image that conjures up look familiar?
Anyway, just to reiterate what I said elsewhere -- feel free to discuss the possibilities here, but MKR isn't on my radar, and isn't likely to show up there. As long as you don't expect me to actually write it, chat away.

-- Bob
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Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[classicdrogn]

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Anyway, just to reiterate what I said elsewhere -- feel free to discuss the possibilities here, but MKR isn't on my radar, and isn't likely to show up there. As long as you don't expect me to actually write it, chat away.

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Eh, maybe someone will get excited enough aboiut it to write a ficfic like the Xanth or toothpaste commercial mini-steps. Won't be me, all I know about MKR is from playing the (untranslated) Gameboy RPG (By looking at the pictures) some Ranma crossover (A Duet of Pigtails? That may be Duo/Ranma GW though) ansd UF:SOS
- CD
Edit: I remembered just after posting, the GW/r.5 is Braids of a Feather, and I can't rmember if it's particularly strong yaoi or not, just that I didn't much like it. Further, having now seen fansubbed Full Moon Wo Sagashite, I will never, ever be able to keep a straight face again when I think of Duo Maxwell and his Fluffy Stuffed Kitty (unless it's a Bunny) of Death... this despite being the one of two characters I'd even consider importing from that show to anywhere else, the other being whatsisname the Sandrock pilot. Thier gimpy little mecha would not come along. (Come on, they're strong by comparison to the popcorn suits of their native world, and probably roughly equal in durability (Judging by the damage visibly taken and doled out onscreen, not by in-continuity materials strength) to first-gen Macross, though generally more heavily armed, but against the more advanced stuff? Then again, maybe it's just because I don't like the basic look of the Gundam universe. anyway, I begin to rant.
--
"Anko, what you do in your free time is your own choice. Use it wisely. And if you do not use it wisely, make sure you thoroughly enjoy whatever unwise thing you are doing." - HymnOfRagnorok as Orochimaru at SpaceBattles
woot Med. Eng., verb, 1st & 3rd pers. prsnt. sg. know, knows

[Evil Midnight Lurker]

Macross Valkyries are armed with mini-missiles, small lasers, and chainguns firing depleted uranium bullets. Except for the lasers, all their weapons could be built with today's technology. Their armor isn't much better than that of today's F-series fighters either.
Gundam Mobile Suits--even those that aren't Gundams--carry particle beam cannons as powerful as those mounted by warships of their universes, and are armored similarly--it's only because offense and defense technology have kept pace with each other that they look just as flimsy. A PBC blast that would put a hole in Gundanium/Gundarium armor--and torch the MS's reactor if you were lucky--would melt a Valk like a wax candle.
(Mind you, I prefer Macross over Gundam myself. I'm just saying that was a bad comparison.)
At the higher end of the scale, Macross dominates--the most powerful beam rifle from Gundam for which we have a megawattage rating, the ZZ-Gundam's Hyper Mega Cannon, is ~75 mw; I estimate the Macross's Reaction Cannon at 10 gigawatts of anime firepower (which may or may not have any relation to the real world, but sometimes seems internally consistent).
--Sam Ashley
"Beware the other head of science!"

[offsides]

Nononono - an Macross Cannon shot is not measurable in any known unit. Put simply, it is an Omega Class Weapon, meaning that anything smaller than a decent sized planetoid will be vaporized upon impact. As in Game Over, Thank You For Playing
Any comparison to other non-Omega Class Weapon is simply moot. And comparisons between Omega Class Weapons mostly involve which one looks cooler...
Just my $0.02
Offsides
Drunkard's Walk Forum Moderator and Prereader At Large

[Guest]

Yeah, 'Duet of Pigtails' is MKR/Ranma. Akane is dead, Ranma and Hikaru are married, and, well, I won't say who the bad guys are, cause it'd be a spoiler, but it's past the end of the MKR TV second series.

[Evil Midnight Lurker]

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Nononono - an Macross Cannon shot is not measurable in any known unit. Put simply, it is an Omega Class Weapon, meaning that anything smaller than a decent sized planetoid will be vaporized upon impact. As in Game Over, Thank You For Playing

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That's Palladium Games thinking. Old-style Palladium at that--these days they'd just give it a mega-damage rating in the tens of thousands (cf. the Nazca Line creatures from Rifts South America).

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Any comparison to other non-Omega Class Weapon is simply moot. And comparisons between Omega Class Weapons mostly involve which one looks cooler...

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Ah, but I have a viable standard for comparison...
Follow the bouncing logic:
The Guyver's "Mega-Smasher" is a particle beam cannon whose power is estimated to be 100 mw.
The upgraded version, the Guyver Gigantic's "Giga-Smasher", is measured at 100 times that--10 gigawatts.
The Giga-Smasher beam is identical in range, width, and apparent firepower to the Reaction Cannon. (Sho fires it from Tokyo at ZX-Tole, who's in high orbit at the time. The SFX are identical to the Macross's booby-trap blast from ep. 1.)
Okay, so it's a bit speculative (a bit?) but I don't believe in letting Kevin Siembieda tell me what is and is not quantifiable...
--Sam Ashley
"Now you're a tiny two-headed bluebird who only speaks high school French!"

[offsides]

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That's Palladium Games thinking. Old-style Palladium at that--these days they'd just give it a mega-damage rating in the tens of thousands (cf. the Nazca Line creatures from Rifts South America).

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Please don't ever mention that atrocity on this forum again - I'd hate to moderate your post out of gut-level reaction

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Okay, so it's a bit speculative (a bit?) but I don't believe in letting Kevin Siembieda tell me what is and is not quantifiable...

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Actually, I'm not letting him tell me, I'm going by what I've seen of Macross Cannon type shots in several different animes, including Macross, Macross: DYRL, Macross II, Hades Project Zeorymer, and at least a couple others that I can't remember right now even though I can see the effects in the back of my head. And lets not forget A.D.A.M. from MZ23 Part II, which has to be the ultimate Omega Class Weapon ("A.D.A.M. stands for absolute disintegration of available mass")...
Any weapon that is capable of simply vaporizing multiple targets in or near direct path of fire, and firing out to a maximum effective range in excess of the visible horizon is not properly quantifiable within the same scale as the other weapons you mentioned. Most notably because at that order of magnitude something that is generally quantifiable is statisically insignificant at that point.

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The Guyver's "Mega-Smasher" is a particle beam cannon whose power is estimated to be 100 mw.

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I think you mean 100 MW not mw - the latter is a laser pointer
And even if we assume 10GW for the "Giga-Smasher", firing for a period of ~5 seconds, that's only 50GJ of energy - that's less total energy than 0.1% of the blast of the bomb that was dropped at Hiroshima (from the wikipedia at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megaton, 1 MT = 4.2 PJ = 4.2 Million GJ). I think it's safe to say that a Macross Cannon is considerably bigger than the Hiroshima bomb in total energy output, just from the damage it did.
Now I'm not saying that the Giga-Smasher isn't an Omega Class Weapon, just that OCWs are in a class by themselves. I'll do a little more research to find specs on the ships vaporized in "Booby Trap" and see if I can come up with a better energy figure to vaporize them. Congratulations, you've caught me in a "Physics is Phun!" mood
Offsides
Give a person a relativistic rock, and they will shatter a planet today. Teach them to do the math themselves, and they will shatter planets for the rest of their lives.Drunkard's Walk Forum Moderator and Prereader At LargeDrunkard's Walk Forum Moderator and Prereader At Large

[Ace Dreamer]

Omega Class Weapons...
These ignore such fun things as the Dimension Ripper, and other 'weapons' which tinker with the nature of reality.
And, for your entertainment, you might want to consider what a "Dimensional Formatter" will do!
(I claim to have invented that one myself! [grin])
Ultra Science, or Ultimate Magic, difficult to tell the difference if you are in the blast area...
For fun, if you don't think these sorts of things are terribly man-portable, you might want to think about what a properly trained Amberite can do to the whole reality that you happen to live in, "Just another inconsequential Shadow".
--
"It is the business of the future to be dangerous" - Hawkwind

[Loki Laufeyjarson]

If you are talking about giant robots with big armament you must mention the giant robot show that really went in for gigantomania: Gunbuster form Gainiax.
Ther might be some minor problems with reloading the Jupiter-bomb from the third Gunbuster, but generally one-shot should be all it takes.
If you really want that expressed Palladium terms, take a look here:
Gunbuster Buster Machine III Conversion for Rifts

[Bob Schroeck]

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And, for your entertainment, you might want to consider what a "Dimensional Formatter" will do!
(I claim to have invented that one myself! [grin])

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This seems like the time to break out another quote from Jared Ornstead's "Otaku Reflected 3: Eva Revolution":
"D, dimensional energy; namely the super dimensional space-time oscillation bomb, code-named the Chocolate Parfait Monster. It's like taking an eraser to reality. Only, the only times it has ever been detonated that eraser has turned out to be a magnet scrambling an old computer disk. If you ever want to experience the birds shining and the sun chirping as you breathe the fire, walk the air, drink the earth, and warm yourself at the water, then this is your cup of tea. But I don't recommend it otherwise. If I were to measure it accurately, each time this bomb has been set off it has left only a sole survivor to the entire human race. But being a *time* bomb, in a literal sense, it has something of a habit of scrambling history back only to a certain point. Fortunately, there is a tendency of reality to reform itself, like water flowing back in to fill a lake that has been emptied by a big volcanic eruption. But there's no telling what the lake will look like each time it reforms, or any guarantee that it will." In the dead silent chamber, Jared said as an aside. "Would you believe the first time this thing was used it was by a nation trying to settle a *land dispute* with a neighbor? We didn't have aliens invading back then. But it appears each time this thing gets set off when we get reality back it is just ever so slightly weirder." He laughed good-heartedly. "Not," he said calmly. "That any of you would notice." "Are you trying to claim...?" Accused an old gentleman from across the room. "Oh, pish-tosh." Jared pish-toshed. "By the very nature of the thing, there can be no proof. We're not carrying souvenirs about afterward. I'm not trying to make any claims, you'll never believe them anyway. We're just listing alternative weapons here." "Uh, not to interrupt, but how many times has this thing been set off? And why?" Misato asked. "I mean, if anyone knew how dangerous it was." Jared shrugged. He'd been inventing this stuff on the fly just to fill in before he could get to E, but she had asked a decent question. "First off, there's no guarantee the person who knows about it has any effect on the decision to set it off. The knowledge just doesn't seem to translate for most people. Secondly, there are times when it *has* been set off in full knowledge of what was going to happen when it went. It makes a superb suicide device for those times when Third Impact has already happened, getting a chance to do over again the last critical fights leading up to where it occurred. Anyone I know would take a roll of the dice over an already accomplished extinction, so automates have often been put in place." He sighed, wishing to terminate this and go on. "So far it has been used nine times." "I see." Misato sighed, thinking that for once she'd be grateful for a chance to look at one of those previous lives, where she was beginning to strongly suspect that she'd been a magical girl in a fight verses evil. If this was weirder than THAT, what *was* going on around here anyway? Misato glanced around suspiciously, trying to find if there was any way she could tell. Strangely, Ritsuko was doing the same thing, for exactly the same reasons.

-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Ace Dreamer]

> This seems like the time to break out another quote from
> Jared Ornstead's "Otaku Reflected 3: Eva Revolution":
Yes, I remember that one. Quite cruel...
Sounds a lot more like a Dimensional Ripper.
A Dimensional Formatter is a lot more controlled, and lets you speed up or slow down time by typically factors of up to 1000, similarly increase or decrease volume or mass. Or, just stretch a couple (x & y), for that really large broom cupboard. Life gets really fun when you create extra spacial dimensions! [grin]
Called that because it "formats" dimensions!
--
"It is the business of the future to be dangerous" - Hawkwind

[chibipoe]

Actually, I think Doug would probably fit better in with the events of MKR2, rather than 1. 1 is your fairly standard mahou shoujo tale, with a massive twist at the end. 2 is the fallout from that. Hikaru, Umi, and Fuu thrown in the middle of a war between three countries(worlds, even) all intent on seizing the Pillar system, without really understanding what it is.
But, yes, MKR2 is MUCH darker in tone. I suppose one of the things I like about MKR is that Hikaru is a -lot- like Usagi. A lot of people don't like her due to her personality, but she's someone who believes in what she's doing, and by the events of 2, is even willing to try and bring someone she fought with repeatedly over to her side to help Cephiro's cause. She's a lot more serious than Usagi, though, but she has the same spirit.
Anyway, you've said there probably won't be a MKR step, but I thought I'd throw in my comments because it really is a good story.
(Sorry if there's a rule against resurrecting month-old threads. But I figured I'd start with what I know and move on from there.)"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[Bob Schroeck]

One of these days we have to get around to buying MKR2. We got the original MKR in a box set (and btw, are you finished with it yet, Josh? ), and intended to get the followup but never did. Like I said, one of these days...


-- Bob
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And all the girlies say I'm pretty dry for a wet guy...

[chibipoe]

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One of these days we have to get around to buying MKR2. We got the original MKR in a box set (and btw, are you finished with it yet, Josh? ), and intended to get the followup but never did. Like I said, one of these days...

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I picked up the original some time ago when it was first released, having been hooked into it by Mixx's attempt at the manga. It was quite impressive, IMO. It holds the distinction, for me, of being the most straightforward series that really isn't. Proof that, when not bogging their story down with endless pontification and torment of characters(X), CLAMP can tell one hell of a story. Especially when you consider just how screwed up what they did to Hikaru/Umi/Fuu was.
Just now getting to dive into the second season, though I've read it in the manga format.
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[WengFook]

hmm MKR..... it is certainly an interesting tale, and Doug would certainly try to change the ending.... but it would be hard indeed...
_________________________________
Take Your Candle, Go Light Your World.

[Bob Schroeck]

Too hard -- and wrong, to boot. Heartbreaking as it is, the ending to MKR is necessary by the time it happens.


-- Bob
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And all the girlies say I'm pretty dry for a wet guy...

[chibipoe]

I agree. Hence my suggestion that, if it were to happen, he'd fit better in 2 than in 1. Nothing like a world that is about to disappear as the battleground for a war over something than none of the involved parties really understand fully for the backdrop to a story.
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[zojojojo]

Nothing like a world that is about to disappear as the battleground for a war over something than none of the involved parties really understand fully for the backdrop to a story.
... but he's already doing an EVA step....
-Z, Post-reader at Medium
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If architects built buildings the way programmers write programs, the first woodpecker to come along would destroy civilization.
-Z, Post-reader at Medium
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If architects built buildings the way programmers write programs, the first woodpecker to come along would destroy civilization.

[chibipoe]

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... but he's already doing an EVA step....

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Heh. True. Difference being(to my understanding) is that the world will still be here in Eva. It's just that everyone will be gone. In MKR2, it's the whole enchilada. World. People. All of it will go POOF.
However, as Bob has no plans for writing this(to my knowledge), it's merely entertaining discussion.
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[Bob Schroeck]

Please, feel free to entertain yourselves as long as you understand that I won't feel obligated to do anything no matter how cool your ideas get.


-- Bob
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And all the girlies say I'm pretty dry for a wet guy...

[chibipoe]

Being as I am(to my knowledge) probably the biggest Rayearth fan on this forum, I find the idea quite interesting. I'm almost tempted, with your permission, to try my hand at it, but I don't think I could do Douglas justice.
"This hand of mine glows with an awesome power. Its burning grip tells me to defeat you....
Shining FINGER!" -Domon Kashuu, Mobile Fighter G Gundam

[WengFook]

haha just listen to a song and try to reach that extra centimeter
(says the guy who finds music to be distracting when ever he tries to write.)
_________________________________
Take Your Candle, Go Light Your World.