starship ratings

[A117]

Sorry everyone. Just need a little help here.
1. In a battle between the Enterprise-D and the Scimitar, who would win?
2. What's the firepower, range, speed, manouverability and weaponry of the Enterprise-D compared with the Scimitar?
3. Where does the Scimitar lie in terms of firepower among Federation vessels or Dominion vessels? Or any of the other races in the ST universe?
4. What is the firepower of a Shadow ship compared with ships from the Alpha Quadrant?
5. Whose weapon systems are better, Jemhadar or Shadow?
6. Is the Enterprise-D a match for a Jemhadar dreadnought?
That's about it.
117.

[Valles]

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1. In a battle between the Enterprise-D and the Scimitar, who would win?

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Scimitar, no question. The 1701-E was built with noticably more advanced technology than the -D, along with a considerably more combat-specific focus, and it still got its ass summarily clobbered. That tells -me- everything I need to know.

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2. What's the firepower, range, speed, manouverability and weaponry of the Enterprise-D compared with the Scimitar?

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Firepower I'd WAG at a third to a half as much, cruising range... Given what we've seen Voyager do, either could probably sustain an indefinite mission, but the Enterprise would have a much easier time. Weapons' range... no data available, but probably pretty much equal. Speed, less, but not -much- less. Agility would also go to the Scimitar, probably by a large margin - when they were built, I'm pretty sure that the Galaxy class were on the extreme maximum end of what had been considered possible for a production starship - which'd mean that they'd outmass and outgun their opponents, and therefore not -need- agility... especially with those broad firing arcs. Scimitar was built as a pure killer, and I'd bet that her designers grabbed for every possible advantage they could find.

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3. Where does the Scimitar lie in terms of firepower among Federation vessels or Dominion vessels? Or any of the other races in the ST universe?

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Surfing the far end of the bell curve. I'm by no means a great fan - it's been literally years since I watched enough TV to follow a series - but out of the ships -I- know about, only a Borg Cube would actually outgun the thing, and it's an open question whether a Dominion heavy or one of those big Klingon command ships could match it.

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4. What is the firepower of a Shadow ship compared with ships from the Alpha Quadrant?

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Whatever The Plot Demands. Most likely, however, I'd say that it's somewhere in the zone of 'Borg go OW!' From what we've seen, those Ginzu Beams would be able to ignore ST shields just as easily as they did the armor they faced in canon... although a Spider's -defensive- capabilities don't seem to be anywhere near its offensive ones. Eggshells with sledghammers, really.

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5. Whose weapon systems are better, Jemhadar or Shadow?

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Unless something -really- impressive happened in the 2/3rds of DS9 that I didn't see, Shadow by a mile.

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6. Is the Enterprise-D a match for a Jemhadar dreadnought?

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*shrug* You'll have to ask someone else on that.
Ja, -n
===========

===============================================
"V, did you do something foolish?"
"Yes, and it was glorious."

[Rod.H]

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6. Is the Enterprise-D a match for a Jemhadar dreadnought?

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Unfortunatly that's a no. For its trek-canon (rassemfrassum Bergman) that a wing of those Jem'Hadar bug-shaped ships can take out a Galaxy-class, so against that there Jem'Hadar BMF starship, all the Big E-D could hope to do (without an act of Data or Deus Ex Machina) is drop the shields a few percentage points.
However I do recall (that's if the dreadnought's the one I'm remembering) it has a flaw that makes the Death Star's Trench Run look like a training exersise. The flaw's something to do with the antimatter storage emergency dump hatch cover - I think. Anyway its a plot point of a DS9 ep.
--Rod.H

[WengFook]

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However I do recall (that's if the dreadnought's the one I'm remembering) it has a flaw that makes the Death Star's Trench Run look like a training exersise. The flaw's something to do with the antimatter storage emergency dump hatch cover - I think. Anyway its a plot point of a DS9 ep

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oh dear, that sounds like a botched attempt to make an strong and invincible enemy, then suddenly realising that the crew wouldn't be able to do anything about it..
like discovering that the nose of a behemoth starship contains a structural flaw that when shot at just so, causes the ship to literally peel itself apart.
geez... we wonder who comes up with these ideas... wouldn't you know.. people notice these errors earlier?_____________________________
HK-47: "Love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticule, and together, achieving a singular purpose against statistically long odds"
_________________________________
Take Your Candle, Go Light Your World.

[A117]

Thanks for the input^_^
I still have one more question.
Does anyone have the specs for the Enterprise starship that Riker was commanding when Q brought Picard to the future to prevent a temporal anomaly from destroying humanity and how powerful that ship was compared with all the other ships (Scimitar included)?
I do know that the Enterprise that Riker was piloting was cloaked. It had very powerful phasers - tore through two Klingon ships very easily - the phaser beams exiting the ship from the other side each time it was fired. Picard was with Beverly Crusher. She was captain of another starship (medical). It was mentioned that the Federation could now use cloaking technology as the Klingon Empire had conquered the Romulans so the Treaty of Algeron was no longer viable.
117

[WengFook]

hmm does it matter really? if you are writing a story with all these ships in mind its really up to the plot to determine whether a massively outgunned and out massed ship can take out the other one.
_____________________________
HK-47: "Love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticule, and together, achieving a singular purpose against statistically long odds"
_________________________________
Take Your Candle, Go Light Your World.

[drakensis]

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6. Is the Enterprise-D a match for a Jemhadar dreadnought?

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The Enterprise-D would not have been a match for a Jem'Hadar dreadnought, primarily because Jem'Hadar emergy weapons went right through Federation shields - thus the Galaxy-class ship that the Jem'Hadar destroyed (Endeavor, I think) in the first encounterm, as RodH points out.
By the time of the Dominion War, the Federation had upgraded their shields and Galaxy-class ships weren't subject to that. If I recall correctly they're still out massed significantly but the Galaxy-class ships were mass-produced before/early in the Dominion War so they were probably reasonably effective - I'd guess at between three Galaxy-class being on par with 2 dreadnoughts to a 1-to-1 parity of effectiveness.
(They probably stopped building up Galaxy-class ships once the Akira-class was in full production because it's about as good in a fight and only 2/3rds as big so they could build more of them.)
D for Drakensis

You're only young once, but immaturity is forever.

[Rod.H]

I wouldn't really bother with the Dreadnought too much as going by the info the Daystrom Institute has on it you're looking at a possible Fx annomoly, and even if it isn't a 4.5Km long starship is not typical of Star Trek, ya the Borg Cubes equal it.
Resources, tech & crew wise it is pushing the limits, for I don't think it's max warp speed is very high.
What I'd suggest you do is think of what the requirements of your story are and pick the most appropiate for the role and do some more research.
For example I've got one on the boil where an organisation in the 20thCentury acquires the Starfleet database from 'round the 24thC. They have to take little steps in understanding the tech bolting the new engines onto existing airframes, before building an adapted Defiant-class.
--Rod.H

[hmelton]

/QUOTE/
For example I've got one on the boil where an organisation in the 20thCentury acquires the Starfleet database from 'round the 24thC. They have to take little steps in understanding the tech bolting the new engines onto existing airframes, before building an adapted Defiant-class.
--Rod.H
/END QUOTE/
Sorry couldn't resist, when I read your story idea, this came to mind.
(It's a paraphrase of the background material for a wargame that models startrek starships.)
Actually Star Fleet made the same "mistake" back some time after captain Kirks first 4 year mission.
That time the data base was accidentally sent through a time warp to an airforce mainframe in the early 1970's. Naturally it was so badly garbled by the primitive hardware that all it was ever used for was to create a wargame.

I know where you can find hundreds if not thousands of captains...
The next generation technology might be a little unfamiliar, but I know a group of starship captains that could almost out fight Captain Kirk.
howard melton
God bless

[classicdrogn]

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They have to take little steps in understanding the tech bolting the new engines onto existing airframes, before building an adapted Defiant-class.

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Please tell me this includes an SR-71 with glowy red ramscoops and an impulse exhuast added at the rear of the fusilage. Lie if you have to.
- CD
What, you think Samuel L. Jackson isn't going to survive the zombie apocalypse?

SERVO: Loook *deeeeply* into my eyes... Tell me, what do you see?
CROW: (hypnotized) A twisted man who wants to inflict his pain upon others.
" It's crazy to try to spell out all the mega-nooks and hyper-crannies of a Borg contrivance." - Doug Drexler
--
"Anko, what you do in your free time is your own choice. Use it wisely. And if you do not use it wisely, make sure you thoroughly enjoy whatever unwise thing you are doing." - HymnOfRagnorok as Orochimaru at SpaceBattles
woot Med. Eng., verb, 1st & 3rd pers. prsnt. sg. know, knows

[Rod.H]

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Please tell me this includes an SR-71 with glowy red ramscoops and an impulse exhuast added at the rear of the fusilage. Lie if you have to.

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Mmmm, ya. The drive installations for that airframe are still being worked on and tested to see which layout functions with the greatest effciency.
The layouts so far being: Warp Drive coils & ramscoop in the engine pods with the impluse drive either being attached of the back of the pods, or FAST pack-style ventral or dorsal mount on the rear inboard wing-fuselage section; Impulse-fusion turbines replacing the jet turbines and either aerodynamic warp nacelles mounted on the inboard wing section or a warp nacelle pod based on the D-21 drone.
--Rod.H

[hmelton]

/QUOTE/
Please tell me this includes an SR-71 with glowy red ramscoops and an impulse exhuast added at the rear of the fusilage. Lie if you have to.
/END QUOTE/
I've seen several models of what you describe on the internet.
Here is a webpage for one version.
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users.sisna.com/roguewing...ek/rd.html
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howard melton
God bless

[classicdrogn]

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Here is a webpage for one version.

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The trouble there is that it's not an SR-71 with nacelles, it's a structurally very different small ship someone made by cutting up a model of an SR-71 to make it look different and adding some Galaxy nacelles, which is blasphemy twice over. Even the very similar Ambassador precursor isn't as ugly as the Galaxy, and the design generations following it trend sharply back to 'looks fast standing still' as opposed to the Galaxy's 'looks fatass at Warp 9.' Strapping peices of it onto the vivisectioned ruin of the sexiest plane i the skies... he should be dragged into the street and mocked.
- CD opinionated barstids of the universe unite!
ETA: It's been done in one of the novels, apparently. I may even have read the novel in question at some point, since I rmemeber the cover now that I see it, but don't remmber any specifics.What, you think Samuel L. Jackson isn't going to survive the zombie apocalypse?
SERVO: Loook *deeeeply* into my eyes... Tell me, what do you see?
CROW: (hypnotized) A twisted man who wants to inflict his pain upon others.
" It's crazy to try to spell out all the mega-nooks and hyper-crannies of a Borg contrivance." - Doug Drexler
--
"Anko, what you do in your free time is your own choice. Use it wisely. And if you do not use it wisely, make sure you thoroughly enjoy whatever unwise thing you are doing." - HymnOfRagnorok as Orochimaru at SpaceBattles
woot Med. Eng., verb, 1st & 3rd pers. prsnt. sg. know, knows

[hmelton]

I'd forgotten about a cover picture for a star trek novel.
Now that you mention it seems like I remember buying a used star trek novel with a badly damaged front cover that looked vaguely like a SR-71.
The front cover had a SR-71, but if I remember the novel said it was the Space shuttle Enterprise that had the super/Ultra warp drive installed.
Can't remember the name, but do remember the plot.
This researcher ?klingon? living on earth developes a new warp theory and builds "Transwarp" or maybe a hyper slipstream warp drive.
Seems like the university he worked at had access to the a old space shuttle called Enterprise and he built his transwarp drive into it.
Klingon operatives and other star nation operatives find out about his research and all are trying to kidnap him and steal his prototype.
He test the drive on the Space Shuttle enterprise and outruns every thing trying to catch him.
He comes back to earth and destroys his notes and the drive to keep both the federation and empire from getting it.
Anyone remember the name of this Novel?
FOUND IT and my memory was wrong about the cover.
"Flag Full of Stars" and it shows a Federation saucer chasing the space shuttle on the cover.
www.amazon.com/gp/reader/...eader-link

howard Melton
God bless

[Rod.H]

Someone had a link to the right book's cover and now I can't find it. I've read it too and probably remember more of it then most, your looking at a TOS to Movie era aerodynamic scout shuttle intened for the transportation use of Starfleet's pre-warp planetary culture researchers.

[classicdrogn]

The messageboard thread I linked to has a (german edition) novel cover with Motionless Picture era uniforms and an SR-71 with TOS-style Bussard ramscoops on it. My German is really pathetic, but I can still tell that the title is something about "Intrigue", probably "A Taste for Intrigue" ... except that doesn't turn up much when I search on it and "star trek."
I'm pretty sure I did read thhe book, now - it wasn't a Starrfleet craft at all, but a privately owned 'project ship' of ... an ambassador or something? Someone who found it an interesting diversion to put it into stable orbit with a manually controlled burn on the impulse pack, I think, unless that's crossbleed from comments on one of the modified SR-71 plugins available for XPlane, with an added rocket booster. I'm relatively sure it was this book, though - the things I remmeber from XPlane were the grand-piano-as-lifting-body (surprisingly wrkable, apparently) and the green Arcadia nodeled as a zeppelin. And that you can only use the trim controls unless you register, which I didn't and don't have ready cash to do.
- CD
What, you think Samuel L. Jackson isn't going to survive the zombie apocalypse?

SERVO: Loook *deeeeply* into my eyes... Tell me, what do you see?
CROW: (hypnotized) A twisted man who wants to inflict his pain upon others.
" It's crazy to try to spell out all the mega-nooks and hyper-crannies of a Borg contrivance." - Doug Drexler
--
"Anko, what you do in your free time is your own choice. Use it wisely. And if you do not use it wisely, make sure you thoroughly enjoy whatever unwise thing you are doing." - HymnOfRagnorok as Orochimaru at SpaceBattles
woot Med. Eng., verb, 1st & 3rd pers. prsnt. sg. know, knows

[Rod.H]

It's Traitor Winds by L.A. Graf (a writing collective apparently), the only time I've ever seen a copy of it, is in a library. Heck when I was in the Trek novel collecting mood I never even seen a printer fresh copy.
Still that German translation of the title...
--Rod.H

[classicdrogn]

I fonud some more good Prometheus kit imaes - what do you mean 'not relevent,' at max warp 9.875 and max sustainable 8.8 it's the fastest Starfleet ship to ever appear on screen, just like the SR-71!
Anyway, they're here and have an aft view I haven't een on a RL model shot of this one before, that really makes the seperation line between alpha and beta hulls obvious.
Since the last time I went on a Prometheus rant in A117's earlier thread, I've done some sketching over a prior concept art sketch from the developement stages of Protheus and come up with something that has better looking seperated hulls, and whose alpha hull could be produced seperately as a short-range multi-role ship, with swappable bays for heavy weapons, science, medicine, or passengers - the beta and gamma hulls are longer, taller, and narrower in the 'arrowhead' parts, more like the Soveriegn engineering section, the alpha hull has warp engines integrated at the trailing corners of the saucer instead of dinky flipouts and a Reliant-like rollbar for sensors and some torpedo tubes of its own. Alas, the perils of graphics-geekdom combined with space opera geekdom.
- CD
What, you think Samuel L. Jackson isn't going to survive the zombie apocalypse?

SERVO: Loook *deeeeply* into my eyes... Tell me, what do you see?
CROW: (hypnotized) A twisted man who wants to inflict his pain upon others.
" It's crazy to try to spell out all the mega-nooks and hyper-crannies of a Borg contrivance." - Doug Drexler
--
"Anko, what you do in your free time is your own choice. Use it wisely. And if you do not use it wisely, make sure you thoroughly enjoy whatever unwise thing you are doing." - HymnOfRagnorok as Orochimaru at SpaceBattles
woot Med. Eng., verb, 1st & 3rd pers. prsnt. sg. know, knows

[WengFook]

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L.A. Graf (a writing collective apparently),

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affirmative.. a friend was telling me that L.A. Graf actually stood for Lets All Get Rich And Famous... which is the funniest semi-scam-like thing i've heard in days _____________________________
HK-47: "Love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticule, and together, achieving a singular purpose against statistically long odds"
_________________________________
Take Your Candle, Go Light Your World.